HOST:
Joining me on the program to discuss this and other matters of the day, the Assistant Treasurer David Bradbury at the Sky News Centre and in Sydney we've got the Shadow Assistant Treasurer, Senator Mathias Cormann. Gentlemen, good morning.
BRADBURY:
Good morning Kieran.
HOST:
David Bradbury, first to you. The warning from the Sri Lankan authorities is very, very clear. The High Commissioner is saying send the group back immediately. Is it time the Government adopted Coalition policy and did just that?
BRADBURY:
The policy that we have been implementing in relation to Sri Lanka has been, after having undertaken preliminary reviews of whether or not someone has a valid claim to make out, sending them back and indeed, as Minister Clare has pointed out in the introduction there, about a thousand Sri Lankans have been sent back very promptly because it was found that they did not have a basis for making an asylum claim. So I think that what we've done in the past is exactly what we will be doing in this case. Obviously what makes this one stand out a little bit is the fact that the boat did get as close to the mainland as it did. Of course, this is not the first time this has happened – certainly it happened many, many, many times under the former government – but of course, regardless of where the boats are, the Australian Government will be taking the prompt action, particularly in relation to those Sri Lankan individuals that may not be having a legitimate claim.
HOST:
Senator Cormann, the number of arrivals has slowed. I want to play you a comment from Jason Clare before I come to you; Jason Clare pointing out this morning on the Seven Network that the indications in interviews with those on board are that they wanted to get to the New Zealand mainland, not to Australia, hence their arrival so far south of the mainland. Let's play you Jason Clare, the Minister for Customs and Border Protection. [Audio]
HOST:
Senator Cormann, that would indicate that this is an anomaly and as the Government has argued, the boat numbers have slowed since their policy of repatriating the Sri Lankans has stepped up since August last year.
CORMANN:
Minister Clare is asking himself the wrong question. The question is not why this boat went to Geraldton. The question is why could this illegal boat arrival get to Geraldton undetected? It doesn't matter if they wanted to go to New Zealand or where they wanted to go. This is a boat that came within 400 kilometres of Perth. I mean, the equivalent for people in Sydney is an illegal, undetected boat arrival in Port Macquarie. It's just completely unbelievable. This Government has lost control of our borders, and this proposition that the numbers have gone down, we've had more than 1,000 illegal boat arrivals over the last nine days. I mean, this is the Government that has cut the resources of Customs and the Navy, they've dismantled a highly successful border protection policy framework from the Howard Government. The results are there for all to see and at the next election, Labor should have to pay the price for this.
HOST:
David Bradbury, that is a concern, is it not? I know the Government's announced a review, but this boat reached the mainland and as the Sri Lankan Navy said itself that this will encourage others to do the same. How much worry is it that this vessel could make it to pretty much within swimming distance of the coast?
BRADBURY:
I just remind Mathias, who points out that the Howard Government got the matters under control but didn't make the point that, I think it was 19 boats, made it to the mainland – 19 boats made it to the mainland, and indeed I remember very well, turning on the TV several years ago and finding out that a group of asylum seekers first presented to a fish and chip shop. Nobody had detected them, not only to the mainland but they got out of the boat and walked to the fish and chip shop! So we can go back and talk about all these things, but the point that the Minister is making is that there are measures that have been put in place that have seen a dramatic reduction in the number of people coming from Sri Lanka. That is on the record, and what it does appear in this instance is that so effective have those measures been in relation to the Sri Lankan pipeline that Sri Lankans in this case, in fact, were heading to New Zealand, not Australia. Look, in the end, we say that the most significant thing that we still need to do is we need to put in place the Malaysian arrangement. Of the Houston Panel recommendations, that is the one big outstanding matter. We call upon –
HOST:
There's also an outstanding matter in terms of excising the mainland from the migration zone.
CORMANN:
Indeed.
HOST:
It's passed through the House of Representatives but hasn't passed the Senate, therefore this group won't be able to be sent to Nauru or Manus Island for processing, David Bradbury?
BRADBURY:
Well let's just wait and see what does happen. They may well, if they don't have a claim to be made, dealt with in the same way as those other Sri Lankans that have previously sought to come through the same pipeline, but in terms of that legislation, we are committed to passing that legislation, that is something that has passed through the House of Representatives and is now before the Senate. Can I make the point that there are a number of key elements from the Houston Panel that the Opposition has thumbed its nose at, one of course is the commitment to increase the humanitarian intake to 20,000 in order to take the pressure off back in those areas, to make sure that people are coming through the right channels. But significantly, and most importantly, we have always said that the most significant thing we can do to deter people is put in place the Malaysian arrangement, that we can send a very clear message that we will take people back, at least part way of the journey –
HOST:
Okay, I'll just go to Senator Cormann there. Senator Cormann, you can, but I just wanted to ask you about the point that the Government's made repeatedly over the last couple of days. There have been two boats arrived or reached the mainland in five years, there were 19 that reached the mainland in the Howard years, so doesn't that make the Coalition's attack on the border, on the customs surveillance and so on ring a little hollow?
CORMANN:
Obviously during the Howard Government years we did what needed to be done to ramp up border security. We increased resources to Customs, we increased resources to the Navy, we put in place a strong border protection policy framework and of course, towards the end of the Howard Government the problem was largely solved. Now, I mean, the comments that David Bradbury just made are completely disingenuous. Firstly, as far as the Malaysian people swap deal is concerned, that was to send 800 illegal boat arrivals to New Zealand, ah, to Malaysia, in order to take 4,000 back. Now just over nine days we've had more than 1,000 arrive, just over the past nine days.
BRADBURY:
But why won't you support it?
CORMANN:
That would have been – well because it doesn't work –
BRADBURY:
Well how do you know?
CORMANN:
And because Malaysia hasn't signed the relevant convention, so… and the next point of course is that Labor is not serious about border protection. They've had this legislation languishing in the Senate for weeks now to excise the Australian mainland from the migration zone, they haven't done anything to progress it in a timely fashion. Instead we wasted weeks on an attack on the freedom of the press.
HOST:
Senator Cormann, I want to ask you another point though. There must be real concerns within the Coalition as to whether anything will stop the boats, even if you win Government as many expect you will in September. You've talked up a big game, but given that the flow, the on-rush of vessels that we've seen, are you concerned that nothing that you will do will be able to stop what is enticing these people to come to Australia?
CORMANN:
We will stop the boats, we've done it before and we would be serious about it, unlike the current Government. We will ensure that whatever needs to be done to stop the boats will be done, including, of course, not only having a serious commitment to offshore processing, temporary protection visas as well as turning the boats around when it's safe to do so. But in order to turn the boats around, when it's safe to do so, you've got to be able to detect them. This incompetent Government doesn't even know when the boats get here until they get to Geraldton.
BRADBURY:
Kieran, if I could just respond to that. Mathias, just a moment ago, in relation to the Malaysian arrangement said, we don't support the Malaysian arrangement because Malaysia hasn't signed the Convention, yet he's talking about turning the boats around. Tell me Mathias, which countries are you going to turn them around to? Which countries that are signatories to the Convention? What hypocrisy if you're talking about sending them back to Indonesia or sending them back to Malaysia, to countries that have not signed the Convention. This is absolute hypocrisy. You can support Malaysia and let us get on with the job.
CORMANN:
Governments have done it in the past [inaudible]
BRADBURY:
And you're saying we should only send them to countries that have signed the Convention.
HOST:
Okay, let's take a break we'll be right back, stay with us. [BREAK]
HOST:
This is AM Agenda, thank you very much for your company. With me this morning, the Shadow Assistant Treasurer Mathias Cormann and the Assistant Treasurer, David Bradbury. Gentlemen I want to talk about high-speed rail. The Government's going to be releasing today this feasibility study into the prospect. Now it looks very expensive - $50 billion from Sydney to Melbourne, built by just after 2030 so it's a long timeframe as well, but in the end the net economic benefit would be $2.30 according to this feasibility study, for every dollar spent on the high-speed rail. David Bradbury, is it ever going to happen?
BRADBURY:
Well look, I think that if people do what has always occurred in the past and that is to put this in the too-hard basket, then the answer is it'll never happen, but I think people have to be realistic about what can be achieved. I think that we can recognise that this would be a very significant project that would deliver a real productivity gain to the national economy, but it is also a project that would take a considerable period of time. It is a monumental task and it is one that would need to be worked through. I think the real question here is, first and foremost let's wait for the Minister to release the detail of the report, but the real question here is whether or not we allow this to be discarded and put back in the too-hard basket, or whether or not we find a way to progress the discussion so we can find a way to explore the benefits that this could have to the national economy.
HOST:
What do you think Senator Cormann? It would take a bit of heat off other areas of infrastructure, and according to the report also it forecasts and economic return.
CORMANN:
Well look, all of us, we want to see a world-class infrastructure for Australia. The problem though with this Government is that Labor is always good at the grand promises and raising expectations and putting billions and billions of taxpayers' money on the line – we're already heading for $300 billion of Government debt – this Government will never be able to deliver anything like this sort of project because if you look at their track record in the past they've always overpromised and not delivered. Now, as far as we're concerned, we've got a realistic plan for infrastructure. We've already committed $1.5 billion to the WestConnex project in Sydney, $1.5 billion to the East-West Link in Melbourne, $5.6 billion to the duplication of the Pacific Highway. We'll be making some announcements about the funding for infrastructure in my home state of Western Australia closer to the election, so we've got realistic, achievable projects on the table which will be underway within 12 months of the election of a Coalition Government.
HOST:
To the NBN, a CSIRO expert in the Fairfax press this morning, Senator Cormann, says there are technologies already coming into the marketplace that will push the limits of the Coalition's bandwidth capacity. Is there a risk it's going to be obsolete, your alternative, before its even done?
CORMANN:
That is a risk of Labor's NBN project of course, because Labor's pie in the sky speeds will not be available for decades on the current roll out timetables. What we've announced earlier this week is a plan for faster, better broadband sooner, of course in a more affordable way for taxpayers and for the end consumer. Under our plan, people will be able to benefit from significant improvements in the quality of their broadband by 2016, whereas under Labor's very, very, very slow roll-out it will be decades before they get to where they say they want it to be.
HOST:
David Bradbury, has the management of the NBN, the delays in the roll-out etcetera, that Senator Cormann alluded to, has that hamstrung the Government's message when it comes to the broadband network?
BRADBURY:
I don't think so at all. I heard Mathias front with his three-word slogan where he says we will deliver it faster, well he couldn't possibly mean a higher speed, because even Malcolm Turnbull has conceded they will be vastly lower speeds, so the only thing he can be talking about is getting it to you sooner, well we can roll out walkie-talkies to people tomorrow if that's the concern. The real issue here is, whichever plan you are looking at we are going to be spending tens of billions of dollars on what is going to be a significant infrastructure project for the future – not for tomorrow or the next day, but for the next 50 or 100 years. Now the Coalition want to shackle us
CORMANN:
[Inaudible]
BRADBURY:
Well with the speeds we have available with fibre to the premises compared to the shoddy speeds available on your plan, then there will be much greater opportunities. I make this point: the fundamental flaw with the Opposition policy is they want to shackle our NBN network to the ageing and degrading copper network. Just about every single complaint I get into my office about broadband, the problem occurs within about 100 to 500 metres of the person's house. That is actually the most critical area, where the ageing, degrading copper network is letting the system down at the moment, and their plan is to spend tens of billions of dollars but it only gets you back to the situation where it only gets you the problem of using the ageing, degrading copper network. It is last century's technology, we need to take fibre all the way to the premises.
HOST:
I want to ask you one last issue and it's out of politics to a degree, although it was very political around the Crime Commission report. This is drugs in sport. There are dramatic accusations made by the former sports scientist at Essendon relating to the coach there. There's going to be a news conference a bit later this morning involving the chairman of the football club. Senator Cormann, what do you make of these allegations and how should they be managed from here do you think?
CORMANN:
Well look, I don't have all the facts in front of me and when I don't have all the facts in front of me I don't feel competent to make an informed comment. Obviously I don't – well I'm very confident that over the next few hours and days and weeks ahead that all will be revealed that needs to be revealed. These are concerning allegations. I don't think I can make any specific comments.
HOST:
Okay David Bradbury, your thoughts on this? Following on from the Crime Commission report, of course.
BRADBURY:
Look I think you've got a unity ticket from Mathias and me on this one. The reality is that there are investigations ongoing and I don't think it serves anyone's purposes for politicians to be commenting or providing a running commentary on individual cases. Let the process run its course. Obviously we're all concerned about the nature of some of these allegations but let the processes run their course.
HOST:
Okay. David Bradbury, finally to you, the deal done this week. A few problems at home politically but the China deal seen as a win for the Prime Minister. There's every likelihood, however, that this dialogue will occur under a Coalition Government, there is bipartisan support for it but it's at least a win this week.
BRADBURY:
Well look I think people will look back on the foreign policy record of what has occurred in the last three years alone as being a very significant period in Australia's history. We saw the significant gains in further enmeshing our relationship with China that have occurred over the last couple of days, but under Prime Minister Gillard we've seen greater engagement with India, we've seen a strengthening of our already strong relationship with the US. I think that this is a very, very strong and credible foreign policy record and Prime Minister Gillard should be acknowledged for her personal efforts in having delivered some of these outcomes.
HOST:
Senator Cormann, that was a significant step, the strategic partnership with Beijing?
CORMANN:
It was a significant step. Obviously the relationship with China is a very important one for Australia and as you've said in your introductory remarks there is bipartisan commitment for that increase and stronger engagement with China and we've welcomed that.
HOST:
Senator Mathias Cormann, appreciate your time. David Bradbury, Assistant Treasurer, thank you for your time as well.