Tom Connell:
The Productivity Commission will launch a review into the GST payments. It will potentially look at the WA deal, which means the state retains 75 cents of every dollar of the GST. That’s due to reforms introduced by the Morrison government. The arrangement at the moment costs the Commonwealth about $60 billion.
That’s the estimate over the next 4 years. The Treasurer says the review of the deal is fair and financially sustainable. Joining me now, the Assistant Competition Charities and Treasury Minister Andrew Leigh. Thank you for your time. Now, I know Labor takes taxpayer money seriously, so if there’s a review – everything’s on the table, including WA’s GST distribution? Is that accurate?
Andrew Leigh:
Well Tom, as you accurately said this is a review that was legislated back in 2018. It has to happen before the end of 2026. So, this is really just us delivering on the legislated timetable. We’ll wait and see what the Productivity Commission comes back with. Of course, our goal is to see an equitable and efficient distribution of GST, as is done through the independent Commonwealth Grants Commission.
Connell:
And what about the WA aspect of that? Is that on the table? Is the review allowed to look at it and make recommendations? And would Labor consider them?
Leigh:
Well, that’ll be one of the issues that the review looks at. That was legislated back in 2018 when the legislation passed the parliament with bipartisan support. So, it’ll look at that along with a range of other issues. Obviously, we’re always looking at how we can modernise arrangements and ensure that the system is working as well as possible.
Connell:
So, we had Patrick Gorman on air today say, guaranteed nothing’s being touched with the WA GST distribution. Is that just something a West Australian MP has to say?
Leigh:
Patrick is absolutely right. We have no plans to change those arrangements.
Connell:
But if the review says you should, then you might get some plans to change them? Is that accurate?
Leigh:
Tom, you don’t do a review in order to jump ahead of it. We’re putting in place a review. We’ll wait and see what it comes up with.
Connell:
So, he’s right to say there are no plans but equally, you would consider that proposal if it were to be put forward by the Productivity Commission?
Leigh:
I think you’re splitting hairs. We’ve commissioned this review, which is a review that’s part of legislation. It’s about as dull in process as you can imagine.
Connell:
Well hey! This is billions of dollars potentially. And the sustainability of the budget might be dry, but it matters. I mean, are you sort of indicating you wouldn’t hold it if you didn’t have to, just because it’s legislated so that’s why it’s happening? That’s the only reason?
Leigh:
It is legislated, and we’re delivering on that.
Connell:
Okay. So, if it does recommend something around WA, you’ll look at it just to clarify?
Leigh:
Tom, I know your appetite to jump to the end of the…
Connell:
Oh, I just thought, you know. Want to make sure that the taxpayer‑funded review is something that will be genuinely considered I suppose.
Leigh:
I admire your tenacity on this Tom, but we’ll wait and see what the review comes back with.
Connell:
Alright. Donald Trump – meeting with Anthony Albanese. Now, he said at the UN climate change is a con job. Is the onus on the Prime Minister in a diplomatic way to try to convince him that’s not the case if Labor is seriously concerned about global emissions?
Leigh:
Well, the US President’s views on climate change are well known, and no surprise that he reiterated them here. It’s also no surprise that our Prime Minister went to the United Nations talking about the clean energy opportunity. Now, I think we need to get out of this zero‑sum thinking – the idea that it’s a choice between jobs or the environment. What Australia is showing is that we can have both. We can be a renewable energy superpower creating jobs in solar installation, in batteries and in wind.
Connell:
But if we’re sort of doing all sorts of work in Australia to worry about our emissions, which are 2 per cent or so of the global emissions, it would be a much bigger impact if we could have some impact on Donald Trump? Should Anthony Albanese try to convince him? Or the long held view that you spoke about then, is it just a waste of time?
Leigh:
Well, we’re looking to have an impact on the globe and principally we’re looking to do that through hosting the Council of the parties – COP31. We’re putting in a bid to host that in Adelaide next year. That is an important marker of Australia’s commitment to climate change and our willingness to work with like‑minded countries. We’re keen to attract overseas clean energy investment, keen also to work with other countries. And we’ve done that through our ambitious but achievable 62 to 70 per cent emissions reduction target by 2035.
Connell:
Is it a quixotic task to try to convince Donald Trump of the merits of what you spoke about?
Leigh:
Look, I don’t imagine that will be a major focus of the conversation between the Prime Minister and the President. I think our focus is going to be on areas like AUKUS and shared collaboration.
Connell:
I’m going to add something to your title from the introduction – you’ve become the Minister for Supermarkets. Aldi, Coles, Woolworths and IGA comparisons were done. I was interested to see 3 of them very close together. Has something happened? Because, I don’t know, a year or 2 ago I felt like Aldi was always the cheapest. Now it’s quite close. What’s happened to these prices in the comparison world?
Leigh:
Yeah, in the CHOICE comparison the gap seems to be narrowing. If that’s competition at work, that’s a good thing. We now have Aldi about 2 to 5 per cent cheaper than the major supermarkets across most Australian markets. Aldi is cheapest in NSW, a little bit more expensive in other jurisdictions. One of the challenges as you know Tom, is that Aldi doesn’t operate out of the Northern Territory or Tasmania. And I know parliamentary colleagues in both of those jurisdictions would be keen to see them enter that market to get the competition boost you get when Aldi comes into the market.
Connell:
Is IGA a bit hardly done by? They’re a much smaller supermarket, often a little sort of, you know – they don’t have the economies of scale like the others. Is it a bit unfair to compare them with the others? And it looks like they’re ripping you off?
Leigh:
They’re smaller and they set prices store by store, and so you don’t get the state‑wide pricing that you get with the bigger chains. I think it is useful for Australians to know the prices that they’re getting at IGA, and people might choose to get a smaller portion of their basket from those stores or just take advantage of the convenience of having a supermarket within walking distance.
Connell:
So, the gap has closed between the 3 biggest players. Do you still do your multi‑shop? Because you spoke about that once in the program that you do 2 or 3 different supermarkets which I don’t know, it surprised me a bit. Maybe I’m lazy? We do the online shop and I can’t be bothered. Do you still go to that length?
Leigh:
I do from time to time. And certainly, we know that split basket shopping is up among Australian consumers. You see that in the credit card data and you also see it in the locations of Aldis, Tom. So, a lot of Aldis are located within a few hundred metres of a Coles or Woolworths – precisely in order to entice customers to engage in this split basket shopping.
Connell:
Split basket. My kids are usually screaming at the end of the first shop I’m in, so I’ll just stick to the one basket. But good on you for taking the time Andrew Leigh, thank you.
Leigh:
Thanks Tom.