SUBJECTS: Peter Slipper, elections, Queensland federal parliamentarians, 1200ks for Kids.
AUSTIN:
Steve Ciobo is the Federal Liberal Member for Moncrieff. Steve, good morning to you.
CIOBO:
Good morning Steve.
AUSTIN:
Bernie Ripoll is the Federal Labor Member for Oxley. Bernie, good morning to you.
RIPOLL:
G'day Steven, how are you?
AUSTIN:
Very well. Gentlemen let me ask you first of all your personal reaction to Peter Slipper's resignation.
RIPOLL:
I can start. Look, I was a little bit shocked but didn't think that it was unexpected given the pressure that was coming on Peter Slipper personally and in terms of the Parliament and I think in the end he did the right thing to resign because it was becoming an untenable position for him personally; for him as Speaker and for the Parliament to continue down this destructive path which the Opposition had been pursuing. So in the end he did the right thing. He's apologised for any offence his comments may have made in the time before he was Speaker and in relation to Mr Ashby.
AUSTIN:
Your response to Peter Slippers resignation please Steve Ciobo.
CIOBO:
Well look, I welcome his resignation. The fact is that in many respects Steve, I've been in politics now for eleven years, and I've gotta say that yesterday I thought was the lowest day that I have participated in in politics. I thought that frankly the Australian Parliament, especially the House of Representatives did itself a great disservice. The discourse, the debate as far as I am concerned just continues to reinforce negative perceptions about politics and politicians in this country. I sat there, you know, thinking to myself, well this really is quite a low point in Australian politics. The great shame from all of this of course was that we didn't see standards. The Opposition called upon Peter Slipper to stand aside and call on the Government to make that happen. Of course, Julia Gillard used her numbers in the Parliament to reinforce that he should stay and then subsequently Peter Slipper was the one who was able to step up to the plate and say no look, my position is untenable, I am going to stand aside.
RIPOLL:
Steve, we can lift the standard today and that's easy if the Opposition stops down this negative path of day-in day-out with one simple strategy and that's blow the place up. Let's make it as hard as possible on the Government, let's call for an election every single day, let's make the Parliament unworkable, as an Opposition let's not agree to work with the Parliament, with the Speaker, with anybody. Let's make this the toughest, adversarial environment you could possibly ever have in Australian politics. So, I agree with Steve. Yesterday was a terrible day. It was a bad day for Parliament, it was a bad day for everybody. We can change that today.
AUSTIN:
Bernie Ripoll, can I ask you. The Opposition did try and stop Peter Slipper from becoming Speaker and put up nine alternatives and the Government rejected all of those. It's not really fair to (inaudible).
RIPOLL:
Of course, we would have rejected a hundred.
AUSTIN:
(Inaudible) when it's the Government who supported Mr Slipper and the Government who made sure that he was the only one that would be accepted.
RIPOLL:
Steve, we can all play those games in Parliament. It is tradition and it is the numbers of Parliament that the Government put up a Speaker of their choice and the Opposition can endlessly put up other Speakers who will not get up because they just want to play games. We didn't do that in Opposition. You could, you could that. There are methods for Oppositions to blow the place up every single day if that is what they chose to do with the Parliament of Australia and our democratic system.
AUSTIN:
Bernie Ripoll, let me ask first of all. The real test for the numbers now as a result of this change is on the floor of the House of Representatives. Are you going to be able to get Bills passed on the floor of the House of Representatives? In other words, is the Government going to be able to operate today?
RIPOLL:
Well Steve, I hope so. And what we have done as a Government for more than two years now is exactly that. Through good negotiation, through working with the Parliament, working with all sides, we've managed to get pretty much all of our Bills through Parliament, pretty much our agenda through with some incredible changes that have been very positive for the Australian community. Let's see what today brings. We're not guaranteed of numbers and perhaps nor should we. This is a hung Parliament. But we will continue to work in the interests…
AUSTIN:
Bernie, if you've been arguing, you've just told me you can, you've been able to get all your Bills through Parliament, why has the Government been trying to blame Tony Abbott for being obstructionist if everything is getting through. Clearly, if your Bills are getting passed, Tony Abbott is not being that obstructionist.
RIPOLL:
Well, he's being obstructionist with every single Bill. I mean there literally has not been any support at all. Even on the things that we may normally agree across.
CIOBO:
Bernie, that is just a completely ridiculous assertion.
AUSTIN:
Steve Ciobo, please let him finish sorry. Bernie Ripoll keep going.
RIPOLL:
Look, the only assertion I'm making is that we've been able to pursue or agenda and get our agenda through because we've had the supports of the Independents through that, certainly not through any support through the Opposition in areas where you might find that there would be some support. Look, from time to time there are Bills that on both sides we all agree on and we pass. But the reality is as a hung Parliament and a minority Government, it has been difficult but we have managed to achieve our agenda and we've managed to pass our Bills and we expect that we'll continue to do that today and in the future.
AUSTIN:
So you think Parliament will still be able to operate today?
RIPOLL:
Of course it will. Of course it will.
AUSTIN:
The real test is when you have your first bits of legislation go through the House of Reps today, won't it Bernie.
RIPOLL:
Well look, absolutely and we will see where the numbers fall. I mean, there is always the opportunity for the crossbenchers to make their own decisions and make their own mind up on whether they support a Bill or don't support a Bill. We've managed to negotiate through that and pass through our agenda. It's been an effective and workable Government.
AUSTIN:
Steve Ciobo.
CIOBO:
Well Steve, look, the reality is that Bernie and I are in politics. We represent different points of view. His the Labor Party, Julia Gillard's Labor Government point of view. I represent the Liberals Coalitions point of view. But you know I think for anybody listening. Frankly, when Bernie sits there and says that Tony Abbott and the Opposition have done nothing to support anything and opposed every single Bill and you know have stood in the way of anything that Government wants to do. People I believe understand that that is so ridiculous an assertion to make. The fact is that there are multiple pieces of legislation constantly that go through the Parliament but are not opposed. Sure we oppose a bad policy like when dismantled our border protection laws for example. We oppose that and we make no apology for that. We oppose Labor's Carbon Tax laws. Again, we make no apology for that. But to make out that this is the most obstructionist Opposition is plain wrong. More importantly, I can't reconcile how Bernie can sit here and turn around and say look this is a Government that's achieving results. We've gotten every single piece of legislation through, we're delivering an agenda and then in the same breath make the remark that you know they are being thwarted in every attempt to do anything. You see, you can't claim all the credit. The Labor Party wants to claim all the credit for everything that goes right, but then when something goes horribly wrong like Peter Slipper they want to wash their hands of it and say oh no, it's all Tony Abbott and the Opposition's fault. The reality is simply this. We warned against Peter Slipper. We did everything we could to prevent him from becoming Speaker. The Labor Party and in particular Julia Gillard embraced him and yesterday the turning point was simply this. We said the time had come. It was untenable, he needed to go. The Labor Party and Julia Gillard stood in opposition to that. They used their numbers to crunch it through to make sure that Peter Slipper had support. And you know what, in the end Peter Slipper himself came to the position where he said I cannot continue in this role.
AUSTIN:
20 minutes past nine. This is 612 ABC Brisbane. We are Inside Canberra with Bernie Ripoll, Bernie is the Federal Labor Member for Oxley here in Queensland. Steve Ciobo the Federal Liberal Member for Moncrieff a seat based also in Queensland on the Sunshine Coast. My name is Steve Austin.
Bernie, why shouldn't we have a Federal election? Everyone agrees that this Parliament has been particularly ugly, particularly nasty. One of the things that both sides of Parliament agree is that it's been degraded. It's one of those rare moments of unity if you like across the House that the treatment of human beings or their fellow human beings has not been glorious. Why not let the people of Australia sort this out? Go to a Federal election and say look, let's start again, let's take the pressure or the steam out of Parliament House and get some stronger figures for whichever side of politics. Bernie Ripoll.
RIPOLL:
Well look Steve, for the same reasons that it wasn't up to the Members of Parliament to decide to remove a Speaker on the basis that they didn't like him or that he had offended some people. I agree, I was offended too by some of his communications with - at the time his friend before he was employed - and before Mr Slipper was the Speaker.
AUSTIN:
I'm not talking just about the Speaker
RIPOLL:
No no, but what I am saying for the same reasons.
AUSTIN:
The whole life of this Parliament, there has been a whole lot of issues.
RIPOLL:
Well, it's a minority Government, Steve, it's a minority Government, it's going to be tough and the Opposition are making sure that it's as ugly as possible and as tough as possible. They are making sure of that. Their strategy from day one has been simple. Call for an election every day. Make the Parliament as unworkable as possible. Yes, Steve is right, we still manage to get our stuff through, but it's not just about getting legislation through. It's about how the Parliament operates, it's about how democracy is viewed through that prism. It's about if you are on the side that every day say this is unworkable, let's blow the place up, let's call for an election every single day it does make it tough. But two and a bit years in, yes there will be an election at the proper constitutional time. This is not up to, because people think, look it's a bit of a tough Parliament. Yeah, it is tough, yeah and it is a bit ugly at times and that's the robust nature of our democracy. That's what makes our country such a great democracy. That's what makes our system work because we don't fight it on the battlefield in our country. We fight it out in the Parliament and from time to time it will get ugly. Steve is right, we are both politicians. We represent a different set of values and a different view. I agree 100 per cent. But that doesn't mean that whenever times get tough you just call for an election. If we did that then there would be Oppositions calling for elections all the time because it didn't suit their agenda. It never suits an Opposition's agenda to be in Opposition. They want to be in Government. I agree, the Opposition want to be in Government. But there will come a time and they will have their opportunity at an election.
AUSTIN:
Steve Ciobo, why not let the people of Australia sort this out and go to an election and get clearer numbers on the floor of Parliament?
CIOBO:
I'm laughing here Steve because you know I never realised that Bernie and the Labor Government were so precious. Apparently the fact that we constantly call for an election is you know driving them to despair. You yourself just said why don't we go to the Australian people? That's been our point. That's been our point from day one. The reason why we've made that point repeatedly and the reason we make that point consistently is because this Government introduced through the Carbon Tax one of the most significant reforms this country has ever seen. And our point from day one - and again, no apologies for saying that yes we consistently call for an election - from day one this Government introduced a Carbon Tax without a mandate, without the support of the Australian people. It's a bad tax, that's been introduced on a lie because the Prime Minister six days out from the last election said there will be no Carbon Tax under a Government I lead. So we say without any hesitation, this massive reform, this huge impost on every Australian's cost of living should have been put to the People, it should have been subject to an election and the Government should have had a mandate. If we were wrong, if we lost the election, we would have accepted it. But for this Government to do what they've done, for Julia Gillard's six days out to lie about her policy and then introduce the world's biggest Carbon Tax regardless, means this is a Government that is governing without a mandate and without authority and so we never take a backwards step about saying we should go to an election.
RIPOLL:
Steve says if they had lost the election. I'd say they didn't win it.
CIOBO:
You never took this policy to an election.
RIPOLL:
Yeah, I know but I am just saying on the comment you said, Steve said if they had lost the election. Well the certainly didn't win the election because they couldn't convince the Parliament on the floor of Parliament to support them as Government. We have a constitutional mechanism in place, a democratic system which actually deals with minority Governments and deals with when we get these circumstances and it works. It works in this country and it works well and there will be time for an election in proper constitutional time. We are in Government, we are delivering and we are following through on our agenda and we can argue about specific policies and issues as we should. It's just part of the system and Opposition should oppose a Government but we've said consistently that we will ride out this term and we will serve the people all the way through to the end. We are a three year Government and we will do that. It's always up to the will of the Parliament and it has not been the will of the Parliament including to sack the Speaker. The Speaker did the right thing and resigned. That is the will of the Parliament and that again, that's what makes our democracy so good. That's what makes it so robust that we can do these things and we can do them under a set of consistent laws, consistent rules.
AUSTIN:
Gentlemen, it's not really analysis, but a personal observation. Is there something about Queensland Federal MPs, we've had two of them sort of in controversial circumstances lose their positions in the last two years. Peter Slipper now, Kevin Rudd before him. What is it about this place? George Megalogenis wrote a while ago that he thinks that MPs from Queensland have glass jaws. Because it's a winner take all scenario here in Queensland. Now I realise it doesn't apply federally. It does seem to be that when federal Queensland MPs go south, there is a lot of steam and fire around them or something. Have you got any observations about that at all?
CIOBO:
Well I think Steve that… Put it this way when speaking to colleagues interstate that unfortunately many people think Queensland is a bit special. I am not sure why. Queenslanders think it's special too but for all the right reasons. Look, ultimately I not sure there is any difference. I mean there's always problems with associated with MPs from a whole range of different states. We've of course have seen the Member for Dobell Craig Thompson, Labor's member who has had all sorts of difficulties from NSW. There are of course others from other States. Now we have got Bruce Scott who has been elevated as Deputy Speaker the Member for Maranoa from Western Queensland and that's a great shot in the arm for Bruce and a recognition of the contribution he's made. So, I'm not sure there is any difference.
RIPOLL:
Look, sometimes there is a bit more colour and movement in Queensland. The further north you go you seem to get more colour and movement. Look, I think we actually produce some really great politicians out of Queensland. There are some great community representatives. They are really passionate about their communities, really passionate about politics, really passionate about the things we can do. Maybe that's one of the things that stands us out and we are fighters. I think Queensland MPs on all sides, they're real fighters, they really want to achieve things and push agendas pretty hard. Maybe that's one of the reasons, but certainly we have seen lots of colourful characters.
AUSTIN:
Let me finish this up on a lighter note. Something that I know my listeners appreciate hearing about the humanity in Canberra rather than all the fractures. Bernie, you are doing a couple of legs of a charity bike ride next week. Tell me why?
RIPOLL:
Why? Because it is for a really great cause. It's for some sick kids. It's the Children's Health Foundation and the Humpty Dumpty Foundation and I am at the let's say light end of this ride. There's 30 guys riding from Sydney to Brisbane and on one of the legs they're going to do 266 kilometres and I feel for their derrieres. They're going to be in a lot of pain. Look, it's for a great cause. We have people like Darryl Dixon and John Grant and Daniel Mendes who are doing the whole lot (1200 kms) and the beauty is they're raising - just between 30 of them - they're raising $200,000 for sick kids. So, it's a great cause and you'll find lots of MPs here who get involved in so many different charities and do so much community work and so much community involvement. It's one of the things that makes me really proud to be a Member of Parliament.
AUSTIN:
Yes, I think your electorate will be surprised to hear how much work that Federal MPs do actually do in the community. I appreciate your time Bernie. Thank you very much.
RIPOLL:
Thanks Steve.
AUSTIN:
Steve Ciobo, thank you to you as well Steve Ciobo.
CIOBO:
All the best, cheers.