SUBJECTS: Paid parental leave, Steve Fielding, Resource Super Profits Tax, opinion polls
FRAN KELLY:
Joining us this morning on Polls Apart, Financial Services Minister, Chris Bowen, and Shadow Education Minister, Christopher Pyne. Good morning to you both.
CHRIS BOWEN:
Good morning.
CHRISTOPHER PYNE:
Good morning, Fran. Good morning, Chris.
BOWEN:
Good morning, Christopher.
KELLY:
Christopher Pyne, the Government's paid parental leave scheme was [inaudible] in the Senate last night. The Coalition, in the end, didn't quite sign off on it. In fact, there was a parade of Coalition Senators yesterday criticising the Government's scheme. But you're going to support it, aren't you?
PYNE:
Well, we are going to support it.
KELLY:
So you're criticising it but you're going to support it?
PYNE:
Well, we think we have a better scheme and a more generous paid parental leave scheme, and we're not going to vote against the Government's scheme because it is a step in the right direction. There are some minor amendments being moved by the Opposition and other parties, I understand it, and they need to be considered, but the Bill will be passed, look, by the end of today, I assume, and therefore it'll be passed. So I don't think it's, we haven't delayed it.
I mean, it's three, the Government's been in power for three years. If anybody's delayed their paid parental leave scheme, it's the Government and their lack of competence in managing their legislative process. You can hardly blame the Opposition for wanting to consider minor amendments for one day.
KELLY:
No, no, no. The point I was making was that you are going to support it, but nevertheless all the Government Senators were criticising you yesterday. The Coalition's position, if I understand it, is if you win government, you will bring in your scheme within the first year. Is that true?
PYNE:
That's right. So we will support the Government's current scheme, even though it's less generous than ours, and if we are elected in a few months, then we will introduce our own more generous paid parental leave scheme, because obviously we have the right to do so as the new Government.
KELLY:
Sure. Chris Bowen, that makes this a kind of, fairly popular, you would think, political promise from the Coalition in an election campaign. Is Labor ruling out an extension of this scheme at any point to 26 weeks?
BOWEN:
Well, this is our scheme and this is the scheme that we've worked very hard to put in. It's been recommended by the Productivity Commission and of course the Liberal Party needs to be taken with a grain of salt here. They're being led by a man who said parental leave would only be introduced over his dead body and then he's had a road to Damascus conversion.
KELLY:
Which presumably you support, that conversion?
BOWEN:
Well, we're glad that he's seen the light, but of course Christopher called their scheme more generous. It's not more generous when you take into account the fact that it would be paid for by a tax on Australian business, which would put upward pressure on prices. We think our scheme strikes the right balance. It's been a long time coming. We called for a paid parental scheme for a long time, all through the Howard years, many people called for it, and the Liberal Party continually blocked it, continually refused to see the need for it. They've now had a conversion and that's welcome, but we're the ones actually delivering it. They've had a conversion in opposition when it's a lot easier than in government.
KELLY:
Okay.
BOWEN:
We've managed to deliver it. I think it's something that Kevin Rudd and Jenny Macklin can be very, very proud of.
KELLY:
Now, I know neither of you two are in the Senate, but I'm sure you've caught up with the news that Family First Senator Steve Fielding raised the political temperature - I think that's an understatement - in the debate by bringing in the whole abortion issue to this debate yesterday. He said that drug addicts and welfare cheats could get pregnant and then claim the paid parental leave, and then go on and have an abortion. This riled Senators on both sides. Barnaby Joyce called it contemptuous. What do you think Senator Fielding was doing there? Was he really concerned about this or is he trying to attract a bit of political attention ahead of an election?
PYNE:
Sorry, who's - ?
KELLY:
Christopher, you go.
PYNE:
Thank you, Fran. Well, I mean, it defies logic, what Senator Fielding said, because of course by definition, welfare cheats are not in the employment workforce and therefore would not be having access to a paid parental leave scheme. So therefore what we can see, what we can say about what Senator Fielding said is it was a desperate attempt to attract attention to his candidacy for the Senate and to attract votes in Victoria. And I think it's disappointing and embarrassing for him. I have great regard for Steve Fielding but on this occasion I think he's overreached and his position lacks logic.
KELLY:
Chris Bowen, just briefly from you, what do you think and presumably Labor will not be giving their preferences to Family First this time in Victoria?
BOWEN:
We have a moment of agreement between Christopher Pyne and Chris Bowen here. I read those comments in the paper this morning. I thought they were particularly unfortunate, particularly erratic and frankly say more about the approach of Senator Fielding than they do about the Government or the Opposition.
KELLY:
Chris Bowen, just to move on now to the mining tax, but you know, you say that this achievement on the paid parental leave is a big tick for the Government. Isn't the problem for the Government at the moment that nothing is being heard really, beyond the clamour of the mining tax debate? Yesterday again, the big three miners - BHP Billiton, Rio Tinto and Xstrata - met with Martin Ferguson and the Treasurer but they emerged and very quickly made it clear they were not happy, they didn't think the Government was listening to them at all.
BOWEN:
Well, certainly as far as the negotiations and discussions go, both the Treasurer and Martin Ferguson have said that they think the discussions are going well. BHP and Rio can speak for themselves, but we're not just talking to them, of course. We're talking to a whole range of mining companies across the spectrum. You're right, Fran, this is dominating discussion. That's understandable and inevitable. It's one of the things on the Government's agenda. We're of course getting on with the job across a whole range of issues - paid parental leave and a whole range of things that we're working on - but this is the one that's dominating the airwaves.
KELLY:
Yeah, well, no one would know much what else you're doing. That's your problem politically, isn't it?
BOWEN:
Sure, and it is dominating the airwaves, but we can't be governed by a political timetable on this. We have embarked on this reform program; it is a big reform program. It is controversial; we knew it would be, we knew it would dominate the airwaves. But nevertheless, our first responsibility is to get the policy right. That's what we're doing and the politics need to sort themselves out after that.
KELLY:
Christopher Pyne, it's manna from heaven for the Coalition, of course. What are you hearing from the miners? There is all this talk of the Government launching this sort of divide and rule campaign, and they will come off with some kind of deal, which would be very bad for the Coalition coming into an election if the Government can deliver a deal.
PYNE:
Well, in fact, Fran, the reason why the Government's having difficulty with its great big new tax on mining is because it's a bad tax. It was ill-conceived. It didn't go through normal Cabinet processes. It was another decision of the gang of four. Martin Ferguson's admitted this week that he wasn't consulted. Simon Crean has admitted that he wasn't consulted; he's the Trade Minister.
KELLY:
Sure, but that's not your business really. I mean, the point is if the Government does negotiate with some sectors and get amendments that satisfy some sectors, that creates political problems for you, doesn't it?
PYNE:
Well, no it doesn't, because the Government's difficulty is that if they dump the mining tax then they have a massive hole in their budget, and if they keep the mining tax then they're introducing a bad tax. So they've got themselves into a cleft stick. Either way, the Government is in trouble because they've tried to introduce a bad tax. They've tried to do it through not normal processes, through the gang of four making these decisions and now they're paying the price for doing so. So it is the Opposition's business because we actually care about the Australian resources sector, the jobs that it creates and the people who rely on it for their superannuation, so we do care and it is our business.
KELLY:
Chris Bowen, suggestions this morning that some of the mining companies are going to ask the Federal Government to provide stability arrangements. These are the sorts of deals that normally only apply in writing and third world countries. Are they serious about this, do you think, and what does it say? It's a blight on our Government's record, isn't it?
BOWEN:
Well, look, I don't know what the mining companies are asking for in that regard, but I think a lot of the rhetoric here is overblown. Governments make changes to tax regimes, state governments change royalty regimes from time to time, the West Australian Liberal Government was contemplating a change to the royalty regime, and the suggestion that governments aren't entitled to explore that and do that is, I think, an overblown one. And references to sovereign risk need to take into account that if we have a Resource Super Profits Tax, the rate of tax will be known and set at 40 per cent, whereas if you have royalties, they change at the whim of state governments. I think there's a lot of overblown rhetoric about this particular issue.
KELLY:
Okay, just briefly to both of you. Chris Bowen, you first because Christopher Pyne gets the last word this week. This next week could be the final week before an election, which means any polls out next week could be critical in terms of the atmospherics of things. What are you expecting in next week's published opinion polls?
BOWEN:
Well, I think anybody who makes a prediction around opinion polls is a very courageous person. Look, the polls are close. There have been some polls which have the Government ahead and some polls which have the Opposition ahead. I expect that to continue, that sort of close arrangement to continue, and I expect that to continue right up until polling day.
KELLY:
Christopher Pyne?
PYNE:
Well, Fran, I never thought I'd see the day, but I'm happy to quote Mark Latham today in the Financial Review. He says the problem with the Labor Party is that they're always associated with wasteful tax and spend policies. And the reason we have this bad tax is because the Rudd Government is addicted to spending and in order to fund their addiction, they have to introduce new, bad taxes. Alcopops was a bad tax, they've increased tobacco tax and now they've introduced a bad tax on mining. And Mark Latham couldn't have summed it up better.
KELLY:
Alright. Christopher Pyne, Chris Bowen, thanks very much for joining us on Polls Apart.
BOWEN:
Thanks, Fran. Good onya.