Daniel Mulino:
Today the Albanese government is releasing the consultation paper for the News Bargaining Incentive. In relation to the News Bargaining Incentive, the Albanese government is committed to a diverse and independent media in Australia. The Albanese government acknowledges that a public interest journalism is critical to the health of our society, and indeed to our democracy.
Since taking over this role around 6 months ago I’ve consulted extensively in relation to the News Bargaining Incentive, including with a range of stakeholders in the media ranging from local providers of content, regional media outlets, all the way to the largest media outlets in Australia, and I’ve also consulted extensively with the digital platform sector.
What we see today is a consultation paper in which the questions that we’re asking have been informed by that extensive consultation. This is a really important initiative that builds on the News Bargaining Code and will ensure that moving forward we have a more sustainable media in Australia. The incentive will encourage digital platforms to enter into commercial agreements with media in order to ensure that they have sustainable revenue going forward. Can I just reiterate that a strong independent media and public interest journalism in particular is critical to our democracy and that’s why this issue, this reform is so important. Thank you.
Journalist:
So Assistant Treasurer, can you just get through some of the ideas; are you looking to impose fines or to at least get the negotiations that they have to use the Australian content, even if they’re not currently or they don’t want to? Can you just go through that?
Mulino:
Yeah, so this is designed to encourage digital platforms to enter into commercial agreements and we’ve framed it around the commercial agreements that have been entered in to following the passage of the code some time ago. It’s designed not to raise any money. If it works as designed, it will see commercial agreements entered in to by large digital platforms and they will provide fair compensation through those commercial agreements to Australian media for the media content that they – for the news content that they use on their platforms.
Journalist:
What happens if they don’t? Like if they don’t do agreements, like we saw Meta in Canada opting out. What happens if these tech companies don’t want to sign any agreement?
Mulino:
And if they don’t enter into agreements that is where the payments will be levied and so the way that we’re proposing that this be set up, and we’re consulting through this consultation paper on the specific parameters, we have estimated that the previous commercial agreements were at around 1.5 per cent of gross revenue and so we’re going to set the incentive at a level such that if you enter in to agreements and receive a deduction bonus of 150 per cent that the news entity, that the digital platform rather, would then not have to make any payments under this arrangement. But if they don’t enter into sufficient commercial agreements then they would pay the incentive as set out in this paper.
Journalist:
The government’s previously said it anticipated a company is likely to be affected and required to participate are Google and Meta, TikTok, LinkedIn. Is that still your view or are there others that might fall under the criteria, for example, Apple News?
Mulino:
So the criteria that we’ve set out in this paper is a threefold test. It’s a gross revenue threshold of $250 million. There’s then a search and social media threshold and then there’s a significance threshold. We expect that based upon the thresholds set out in the paper that Google and Meta and TikTok will fall within that. As for which other organisations would fall within that, that is going to be part of the fine tuning of those thresholds.
Journalist:
And as mentioned, given Meta walked away from its deal last year, what is the fall back for big companies, if these companies simply refuse to pay?
Mulino:
Well that would be where the incentive payment comes in to play and so this set up is robust to companies walking away and not putting news media on their platforms. The thresholds that I just set out are the thresholds that would determine the coverage of this incentive and so if that incentive did lead to payments being raised then I would be working closely with the Minister for Communications in order to determine how that would be distributed.
Journalist:
And what message does this send Australians about the value of local journalism and the need to protect it?
Mulino:
Well, that independent high‑quality journalism is absolutely critical for our society. It’s absolutely critical for our democracy and so the release of this consultation paper reflects the fact that this government greatly values a sustainable, independent media, news media in Australia. And that’s why we’ve designed the incentive in such a way that it strongly encourages large digital platforms to enter into commercial agreements with news media.
What we’ve seen is that news media now has to deal with these large digital platforms. There are market power issues now as a result of the size of these digital platforms and so it’s important that there be an appropriate mechanism to provide an incentive for those platforms to deal fairly with media.
Journalist:
This consultation paper is being released now less than a month before the social media ban kicks in or is about to kick in sorry. Is there any fear of how the tech companies might react or potentially Donald Trump may react with tariffs given his previous comments about the issues?
Mulino:
So we see these as separate issues, and in relation to this initiative I would flag that this has been something which we’ve been working with the digital platforms on for quite some time. So I don’t think the release of this consultation paper will be any surprise to them. But, look, we will see what the reaction is from a wide range of stakeholders and respond accordingly.
Journalist:
Incentive predominantly hits US companies, are you concerned at all that there could be a reaction from President Trump?
Mulino:
Well, I want to stress that this is agnostic as to the location of the companies. We, as I said, based upon the coverage criteria that are spelled out in this consultation paper, we expect that the companies that will be covered will include Meta, Google and TikTok so there are 2 US companies and one company not based in the US. So this is not about where companies are located. This is about issues relating to market power and the use of news content without appropriate fair compensation.
Journalist:
This consultation paper has been delayed. How quickly can this legislation be passed next year, especially given that existing deals for most media companies have either already expired or are due to expire in the first half of next year. We’ve already felt the effects of those with redundancies and cuts at many companies?
Mulino:
So I’ve been consulting with a wide range of stakeholders over the last 6 months. So a lot of the issues that are dealt with in this consultation paper many stakeholders will be familiar with. We’re asking for comments on this consultation paper by 19th of December. So that gives people sufficient time to properly digest the proposals in the paper and respond carefully. But it also means that we will then, late this year, have submissions from stakeholders and be able to deal with that in a timely way. We’re conscious of the fact that there are matters that need to be dealt with in a timely way and I think receiving submissions by 19 December puts us in a position where we can respond in an appropriate time.
Journalist:
And so what’s the timeframes for passing the legislation?
Mulino:
So I don’t want to try to put timelines on our response to the submissions or how long it’s going to take to develop legislation. But I would simply say that we’ve put this consultation paper out at a time and with a time line of 19 December that we’re going to receive submissions this year. And I think that puts us in a good position to respond next year.
Journalist:
Well would you say it’s a significant priority for the government to get that passed early when Parliament resumes next year?
Mulino:
This is a priority, and as I outlined earlier, we recognise the importance of independent journalism. We recognise the importance of public interest journalism for our democracy and that’s why the release of this consultation paper reflects the priority this government is putting on this issue.
Journalist:
Can I just ask you to come back to the issue of what happens if they don’t pay. You’ve talked about these incentive payments, you might call them fines? Who actually gets that revenue, and how will you enforce it?
Mulino:
So I wouldn’t use that term but what I would say is that if the incentive payments come in to operation that I would work closely with my colleague, the Minister for Communication to determine an appropriate way in which to distribute that revenue to media outlets. That would depend on a number of factors that it’s not really possible to outline in detail today. But the overarching policy goal here is to ensure that we have a sustainable independent public interest journalism in Australia.
Journalist:
Have you not thought through enforcement?
Mulino:
Well we’ve thought through that in the sense that the incentive is structured such that if digital platforms don’t enter in to appropriate commercial agreements at a level that is required in order to avoid that payment, then they will make a payment. But what we haven’t detailed in this consultation paper is the precise distribution of that in the sector. But the overarching policy is very clear. That we want to see a diverse media, an independent media and enough public interest high quality journalism for the sake of our society and our democracy.
Journalist:
Thank you.
Mulino:
Thank you.