Karl Stefanovic:
Well Australia’s leaders are under pressure to take action on the fuel crisis this morning as National Cabinet meets for a second time.
Sarah Abo:
To discuss this we are joined this morning by Treasurer Jim Chalmers live in Canberra. Treasurer, good morning to you.
Chalmers:
Good morning.
Abo:
So will we finally get a national plan to tackle this crisis or are we not holding our breath?
Chalmers:
Well this meeting today is all about recognising that the best way to get through this is to work together in a constructive way, ideally a consistent way around the country. The objective here from this meeting and from our plan more broadly is to keep the country moving to try and avoid some of those harsher, heavier‑handed measures that we’ve seen in the past during COVID, for example. And so, if everyone does their bit, feeds into these discussions in a constructive way today, we hope to keep the country moving and avoid some of those measures.
Stefanovic:
We’re being warned, Treasurer, food prices could soar. It’s hard to see it going anywhere else. But why don’t you reduce the Heavy Vehicle Road User Charge?
Chalmers:
Well that’s one of a number of considerations and contingencies that we have, Karl. I mean the big focus for us has been securing the supply, getting the distribution right, cracking down on the rip offs, helping with the cost of living, including with another couple of tax cuts on the way. But we work through a range of contingencies and fallbacks. We’re always trying to do what we responsibly can to alleviate some of this pressure which is coming from the war in the Middle East.
And so we’ve had that proposal put to us. Obviously we will work through that in the usual way, but already we’re taking a number of important steps to try and deal with what’s coming at us from around the world to try and avoid some of those heavier‑handed measures that we’ve had to do in the past.
Abo:
Treasurer, as you would know though that pressure hasn’t been alleviated and it’s being felt by individuals and by businesses, by literally the whole sector, every sector in this whole country and you talk about not having COVID‑style measures, but that’s exactly what is happening. I mean we’re seeing 2 states, Victoria and Tasmania, now offering free transport. We need something to be national here. We need a national consensus so it’s not confusing state‑by‑state. Why can’t you just assure that?
Chalmers:
Well I agree with you, Sarah, that ideally we’d approach this in a consistent way. I commend the governments of Victoria and Tasmania for taking the steps that they have to encourage more people on to public transport. That seems to us like a good commonsense solution. And one of the reasons why the Prime Minister is leading and bringing this group together today is because we would like there to be a consistent approach around the Commonwealth when it comes to some of these sorts of measures.
Now when it comes to the pressures that people are under, obviously we understand that this war in the Middle East is having an extreme impact on the global economy and Australians are paying a hefty price for that at the bowser, but not just at the bowser. And so we’re taking every responsible step that we can. We’re working through a bunch of contingencies. We need everyone to do their bit, and that includes the states and territories.
Stefanovic:
If the supply’s there though, Treasurer, why are stations running out and why are people – you say that you’re doing stuff about gouging, why are people paying more than $3.50 a litre for diesel?
Chalmers:
Yep. Well, first of all, I mean the ships are arriving, the refineries are doing their job in aggregate. We have very substantial supplies of fuel, but as you know, Karl, there are pressures in particular local areas and so we work with the industry and with the ACCC and others to make sure that we’re getting that supply there. One of the reasons why we stepped up and stepped in to global fuel markets and helping fuel suppliers get more contracted ships in the announcement we made over the weekend is because we want to make sure there’s even more supply and getting to the right areas.
So we know that there are pressures in some areas and we’re working very hard to try and address those pressures.
Stefanovic:
See, it just doesn’t make any –
Abo:
It doesn’t feel like it.
Stefanovic:
– yeah, it doesn’t make any sense to people that you’re saying the supply is there, the fuel is here and we’re guaranteed that supply when some people in the regions are travelling 100K just to get fuel, but stations in the city areas have run out, the signs have literally gone out, the lights have gone out in some of these stations, and for you to keep saying that, reiterating that there is supply when there isn’t in their local service station, when people are travelling hundreds of kilometres to get fuel and then going home, or they’ve got to work somewhere and the expenses just keep rising and food prices keep rising and you say everything’s okay, but it’s just not.
Chalmers:
Well actually what I’m saying, Karl, is not a world away from what you’re saying in that there are pressures in local areas. We understand that. That’s why we work with the industry and the competition watchdog to get fuel where it’s needed, to try and address these localised –
Abo:
So if you’re not achieving that, Treasurer –
Chalmers:
– shortages.
Abo:
If you’re not achieving that, Treasurer, are you conceding that you are powerless?
Chalmers:
Oh, of course not, Sarah. That’s not the point that I’m making. I think –
Abo:
But there’s been no – nothing has been felt. People are not in a better situation now than they were last week than they were yesterday than they were 3 weeks ago, 4 weeks ago. Things are getting worse. You say there are solutions. No one knows what those solutions are. National Cabinet has already met, you’re meeting again. It just – it feels a bit hopeless.
Chalmers:
Well let me tell you what those solutions are then, Sarah. Secure more fuel on international markets, that’s why we’re trying to do. Support our refineries, that’s what we are doing. Helping with the cost of living with tax cuts and in other ways, that’s what we’re doing. Cracking down on the rip offs, empowering the ACCC to issue bigger fines, that’s what we’re doing.
This is all part of our plan. And the National Cabinet meeting today is a good opportunity to work together to work through these issues, to do that in a really constructive way, coordinated way, ideally consistent way, to deal with these very real issues that you and Karl have been raising with me this morning.
Stefanovic:
Do you categorically rule out cuts to the fuel excise?
Chalmers:
Well what we’ve said about that Karl is we’ve had a focus more on supply, more on distribution, more on the rip offs, more on cost‑of‑living relief in other ways. But obviously we always have contingencies and fallbacks that we work through, and we keep under more or less under constant review. This government always tries to do the right thing by people, and we always try and help with the cost of living in the most responsible way that we can –
Stefanovic:
So it could happen?
Chalmers:
– weighing up a whole range of factors. Well our focus has been on other parts of this challenge and helping with the cost of living in other ways.
Stefanovic:
Right.
Chalmers:
But we work through a whole series of contingencies. This war in the Middle East is having an extreme impact on the global economy. People are paying for that here at the bowser and beyond in Australia.
From an economic point of view, the end of the war in the Middle East can’t come soon enough, but in the interim, this government is working very hard to do what we can to help.
Abo:
All right, Treasurer, thanks so much for joining us this morning.