SARAH ABO:
All right. Well, let's bring in Treasurer Jim Chalmers in Canberra now. Treasurer, we'll ask you about Wendy in a moment. But, first of all, how does it feel to break a promise with the Australian people?
JIM CHALMERS:
Well, I want to be upfront with your viewers, Sarah, we have come to a different view about these tax cuts, and we've done that for a very simple reason, and that is we found a better way to provide more cost‑of‑living relief to more people in a way that doesn't push up inflation. So the tax cuts that the Prime Minister will outline today, they are better for middle Australia, better for cost‑of‑living pressures, better for women and workforce participation, better for nurses and teachers and truckies, and better for the economy. Our responsibility as a government is when we find a better way to deliver bigger tax cuts to more people, to help them with the cost‑of‑living then our responsibility is to do that. We've come to a different view, and today we are explaining why we have.
ABO:
A better view, according to you, I mean, the issue that you now face is that you have trust issues to contend with the public. How can the public possibly lean on anything you say and take it as gospel? You took this to the election.
CHALMERS:
Because you build trust by making the right decisions for the right reasons in the interests of the people and you do that even when it's politically contentious and politically difficult as this is. The changes that we are announcing today, the different position that we are now taking is because it's become increasingly clear to us that we need to do more to help people with the cost‑of‑living pressures that they are under. This is the best way to do it and so we're explaining why we've taken a different position.
ABO:
Absolutely, people need help with cost‑of‑living Treasurer. We all know that, but in what world does breaking a promise lead to greater trust?
CHALMERS:
Because what we're doing here is we're providing more help for more people. And so –
ABO:
But you broke a promise to achieve that. I mean, couldn't you have been up front? Wouldn't that have led the public to have more faith in you?
CHALMERS:
We've always said that the tax system is a good way to provide cost‑of‑living relief. We've always said that governments should return bracket creep when they can afford to do that but when we found a better way to give bigger tax cuts to more people, then obviously we should pursue that and that's what we're doing today. You build trust by making the right decisions for the right reasons. People will be beneficiaries of the changes that we are announcing today and that's really important, too. Everybody still gets a tax cut. There are still tax cuts for people on higher incomes, but there's a bigger emphasis on middle Australia, and that's important.
ABO:
Some of those concerns that you outlined there, Treasurer, obviously exist and have existed for some time, so, why didn't you just say that at the last election? Why did you commit to this? This was legislated. You took this to the election and were unequivocal. We know that the Prime Minister, you have all promised this time and time again for two years now, and you didn't suggest that you might revisit it during any moment, especially in the lead up to the election.
CHALMERS:
Well, it became increasingly clear to us, Sarah, in recent times that there was a much better way to deliver the same amount of tax cuts in our economy ‑‑
ABO:
Okay, so when did that start for you, Treasurer, then? I mean, how long were you deceiving the public on this?
CHALMERS:
Well, first of all, obviously, I don't sign up to that characterisation of it. We had a view about these stage 3 tax cuts, and we've now come to a different view for the right reasons as we found ‑‑
ABO:
You don't come to those decisions or those views, though, overnight, do you, Treasurer? I mean, these changes would have been contemplated for some time now. You don't make a decision like this overnight. When did you take this to Treasury?
CHALMERS:
It became increasingly clear to us over Christmas, over summer, that we could deliver these tax cuts in a better way. The Prime Minister has said publicly that he tasked Treasury and the Finance departments, myself and Katy Gallagher, to come up with other ways to provide additional cost‑of‑living relief for people doing it tough. We obviously have been thinking over the summer period about how we do that. We received the Treasury advice and we changed the government's position on Tuesday of this week when the Cabinet agreed to the new tax cuts which are being outlined today.
ABO:
The point being, you had Treasury working on this and these changes while you were still denying it publicly.
CHALMERS:
What we said publicly was that the government hadn't changed its position. The government changed its position on Tuesday, but it did become increasingly clear to us over the course of Christmas that this was the best way to provide more cost‑of‑living relief to more people who are doing it tough.
ABO:
Treasurer, and absolutely, people who are doing it tough deserve all the help they can get. There are people, as you know, who are out there on single incomes. I mean, $150,000 on one income isn't necessarily wealthy for a lot of people. They've made their decisions going forward, sending their kids to schools and so on, based on these promises, based on the fact that they were going to have these extra funds and now they don't have them.
CHALMERS:
They'll still be getting a substantial tax cut, Sarah. I mean, that can't be forgotten here. Everybody will get a tax cut compared to the taxes that they are paying now and for a lot of people, including people on higher incomes, those tax cuts will still be substantial. The emphasis here is on middle Australia, people on low and middle incomes, teachers and nurses and truckies and policemen and women and the like, who are substantial beneficiaries, but everybody still gets a tax cut. People will have some tax relief from the 1st of July, no matter what tax paying income that they are on and I think that's important that we remember that.
ABO:
We know Treasurer, and you would well know, too, that many politicians have made promises that they've broken. I guess the issue that we have here is that surely the public deserves better transparency, considering you had been looking at this for some time. Do you think that this broken promise will cost you at the next election?
CHALMERS:
Well, this is about people, not politics.
ABO:
Well, exactly. That's the point.
CHALMERS:
We've taken a deliberate decision here to get to the right outcome for more people. Even though the politics of it will be difficult, we acknowledge that our opponents will play their usual mindless and nasty negative politics because they don't want to engage on the issue. They have remarkably said that they will unwind these changes, which means going to the election, jacking up taxes on middle Australia to fund an even bigger tax cut for people on the highest incomes. So there will be politics played, there will be people, commentators, who would rather help the Coalition than help middle Australia. We understand that our job is to make the right decision for the right reasons and if we come to a different view, to front up on shows like this and explain our different position, and that's what we're doing.
ABO:
Yeah. And I think the public deserves as much transparency as possible, Treasurer. Thank you for joining us this morning, appreciate it.
CHALMERS:
Thanks so much, Sarah.