BEN FORDHAM:
Treasurer, good morning to you.
JOSH FRYDENBERG:
Nice to be with you.
BEN FORDHAM:
We do need to clarify – you’ve got to pay the money back one day, right?
JOSH FRYDENBERG:
You certainly do. But up to two years repayment free. And, as you say, up to a 10‑year duration of the loan and up to $5 million. Look, these loans have been put in place since COVID began, and we have seen more than 70,000 loans worth more than $6 billion go out the door. And your listeners in New South Wales have made up to a third of those loans. But, as you say, there was also a requirement that you needed to be on JobKeeper in the March quarter. We’re removing that requirement. And this money, Ben, can be used by a small business in their working capital, to refinance their existing loan obligations or, indeed, to expand their business if they want to buy new machinery and equipment. But we know how difficult it is for small business right now. That’s why we need to open up in accordance with it plan agreed by national cabinet.
BEN FORDHAM:
Yeah, Dominic Perrottet, your counterpart in New South Wales, says that the total economic cost to New South Wales so far, $11.7 billion. And that’s why we’ve got to say, “Okay, at some point there’s got to be a line in the sand.” We can’t hide under the bed forever.
JOSH FRYDENBERG:
Well, unlike journalists or politicians or public servants, when you’re running a small business, you’re not getting paid if people are not coming through the door. And they didn’t go into small business just to receive a cheque from the commonwealth or from the state government during pandemics or lockdowns. They went into small business to build something that’s bigger than themselves and to service their community. And so many small businesses have their life savings right now on the line and in many cases, they actually have their own house on the line because it’s been secured against the loans that they have entered into. And when I talk to small businesses right around the country I hear their hurt, the anguish, not just the economic harm that the lockdowns are doing to them but also the impact it’s having on their mental health and that of their staff. Because many small businesses treat their staff like their extended family.
BEN FORDHAM:
Treasurer, we’re told that National Cabinet is weighing up rewards for those who are fully vaccinated. It may mean that vaccinated Aussies can get early access to restaurants or planes or bars or going to watch the footy. Is this where we’re heading?
JOSH FRYDENBERG:
Well, we’ve seen that happen in other countries around the world. And I have no doubt that you will see some businesses restrict entry based on people getting vaccinations. And, as you know, businesses get to determine who comes into their shop or who attends their grounds. And, you know, that is something that will provide an added incentive for people to get vaccinated. I mean, people are rolling up their arms in record numbers. And it’s been incredible to see that vaccination rate increase so rapidly – more than 215 people getting the jab every minute of every day. But people are doing so not just to protect themselves and their family but also because they’re expecting the economy to open up in accordance with the plan agreed at national cabinet. And I’d say to you, Ben, and to your listeners, if we don’t open up at 70 to 80 per cent, then when do we open up? When can businesses reopen? When can we attend weddings and funerals of loved ones? When can our kids go back to school, and when can we travel freely across our own country? This is why we need to give people hope, and the plan agreed by National Cabinet does give people hope.
BEN FORDHAM:
And what do you say to people who are looking at what’s happening in the UK at the moment where the death numbers are back up high again? Is this just a reality of life and death, like any infectious disease? There are going to be people pass away? The same thing will happen here in Australia?
JOSH FRYDENBERG:
Well, you’ve heard from the Doherty Institute themselves that zero COVID forever is unrealistic. That’s what their words have been. And they’ve also pointed out that we do live with diseases right now. And something like influenza sees 200,000 cases every year in Australia and around 600 deaths. But we’ve learned to live with influenza, just as we need to learn to live with COVID. Now, of course, you have a much stronger likelihood of chance of not getting sick if you’re vaccinated, and that’s why it’s imperative that everyone who is eligible does so. But there is no alternative to living with COVID. We can’t eliminate it. And that’s why, based on the medical evidence, national cabinet agreed to this plan to reopen up, and that’s why all Premiers and Chief Ministers need to stick to the plan.
BEN FORDHAM:
Now, the rock and roll world is mourning the death of the drummer from the Rolling Stones, Charlie Watts. We know you’re an ACDC man because way back when you were talking about getting the economy back in black. Do you like the Stones?
JOSH FRYDENBERG:
Sure, I love their music. Never saw them live, but, you know, we all want a bit of satisfaction.
BEN FORDHAM:
Myself included. Catch up again soon.
JOSH FRYDENBERG:
Good on you, Ben.