PETER STEFANOVIC:
Let’s move to Canberra now and joining us is the Treasurer Josh Frydenberg. Treasurer, good to see you. Thanks for your time this morning. So basically, is your work done now? It’s over to respective media companies to thrash out their own deals with Facebook?
JOSH FRYDENBERG:
Well it’s going to go to the next stage now. As I said yesterday, Mark Zuckerberg made clear that he was committed to working in good faith with the Australian news media businesses to reach commercial agreements and it was really good news last night to see a letter of intent announced between Google and Channel Seven and were hoping for more deals to come. We’ve also got to see the passage of the legislation through the Parliament which will hopefully occur shortly with the bipartisan support that’s been indicated. But this is a very significant moment. It was always going to be a complex – always going to be a difficult negotiation, and we saw the market power of digital giants like Facebook, when they pretty much blacked out the Australian news media business from their platform just last week, and I think that was a wake up call for the whole world really.
PETER STEFANOVIC:
He’s gone back on his word before though Treasurer. Do you believe him?
JOSH FRYDENBERG:
Look I think we had very productive, constructive and polite conversations, and he did say numerous times that he was committed to entering into these commercial deals. But let’s face it, neither he, nor Google, wanted this Code, and other countries hadn’t replicated what we had done here in Australia because it is very difficult. All credit to the ACCC and its boss, Rod Sims, for their hard work over a number of years. Scott Morrison when he was Treasurer actually commissioned the ACCC to undertake this report, and what it found Pete, was there was a real unequal bargaining position between the digital giants on the one hand and the traditional news media businesses on the other. And as online advertising has grown to around a $9 billion market, we’ve seen that concentration in the market and that power of the digital giants really be entrenched. So what we’ve sworn to do is create a level playing field. We’ve sought to sustain public interest journalism in this country, and we’ve also sought to enhance and encourage those commercial deals between the parties. So Paul Fletcher, who I’ve worked with very closely on this with, together with the Prime Minister, Treasury and the ACCC, who have been kept up late at night over the course of recent days, and we’ve seen the product of those negotiations just yesterday.
PETER STEFANOVIC:
Have you had more calls from Mark last night?
JOSH FRYDENBERG:
Well there was no need for another call last night –
PETER STEFANOVIC:
No need now. Ok.
JOSH FRYDENBERG:
We agreed on what the next steps were and that includes –
PETER STEFANOVIC:
A ceasefire.
JOSH FRYDENBERG:
No well that includes Facebook restoring Australian news content to its platform, which they said they would do, and they put out a statement to that effect.
PETER STEFANOVIC:
Ok what’s the worst case? A lot of this is going to go over people’s heads. But what’s the worst-case scenario? It looks like the Bill is going to pass, right? So the worst case scenario here being that companies and Facebook can’t agree on a price, it goes to arbitration. If that doesn’t work, again, worst case scenario, does it, just the news feed go blank permanently?
JOSH FRYDENBERG:
Well look I’m focused on a more positive outcome than that, and I think there’s a good basis for that, after what we saw with Google striking those deals with Channel Seven, with The Guardian, with News Limited and also reports of that deal with Channel Nine as well. So that’s a significant development from Google. I’m also aware of smaller players who have reached agreements with Google and they are paying a substantial amount of money. Millions of dollars will flow into Australian news media businesses, as a result of these agreements. And if this was easy Pete, other countries would have moved long ago.
PETER STEFANOVIC:
Yeah. Who was more difficult to negotiate with, Google or Facebook?
JOSH FRYDENBERG:
Well look they were both difficult conversations. But I think it’s not where we started, it’s where we’ve ended, and despite the threats, we now have a workable Code that is looking to pass through the Parliament and we also have commercial deals that are on foot.
PETER STEFANOVIC:
Ok. Are you glad to be rid of Craig Kelly from the Party?
JOSH FRYDENBERG:
Look I’m not going to hide my disappointment in Craig’s actions yesterday. But he has made his announcement, and he did make it very clear in his statement, that he hasn’t made the boat go faster in recent times, and that he will now move to the Crossbench. But he also wished the Prime Minister very well and he said he will provide the support for both confidence and supply in the Parliament, and we’re not going to be distracted. We’ve got a job to do. Yesterday it was the announcement around the JobSeeker payment, as well as the conclusion of those negotiations with Facebook. Today, I’m releasing some new Treasury data - ATO data. Its preliminary data for the January period for JobKeeper, and it shows Pete, that around 600,000 people have come off JobKeeper in January, compared to the December quarter. That’s a really good sign that the economy is continuing to strengthen and recover from this most significant economic shock since the Great Depression.
PETER STEFANOVIC:
Just one more on Craig Kelly, Treasurer. Is there a Department of Finance investigation into workplace safety concerns in Craig Kelly’s office after allegations of inappropriate behavior against a staff member?
JOSH FRYDENBERG:
Well you’ll have to direct that one to the Minister for Finance. But what I can tell you is that he’s now moved to the Crossbench and there are other processes underway then I’ll let them play out.
PETER STEFANOVIC:
Ok. You just mentioned another 500,000 workers that have come off wage subsidies. How many are left now?
JOSH FRYDENBERG:
Look, as of the preliminary data in January it’s just under one million so is a significant number of people. But when we consider that JobKeeper at its peak was supporting more than 3.6 million Australians and around one million Australian businesses, this is a substantial reduction with many graduates across the country from the JobKeeper program. And it is the latest proof point that the labor market has been enormously resilient, in the face of this shock, Pete. We’ve had unemployment come down to 6.4 per cent, we know that around 94 per cent of the 1.3 million Australians who either loss their jobs or saw their working hours reduced to zero at the start of the pandemic, are now back at work and we’ve seen business and consumer confidence recover to its pre-pandemic levels. There is still a long way to go and there are still some sectors and some regions that are doing it very tough. That’s why we’ve got continued support going out into the economy and we are also looking at further targeted support.
PETER STEFANOVIC:
Ok, and just finally under JobSeeker – critics have called the rise a “heartless betrayal”. How much pressure do you think an extra $4 a day will take off someone who is struggling? Particularly for older Australians who really struggle to find work.
JOSH FRYDENBERG:
Well you also have to understand when it comes to the JobSeeker payment, the vast majority of people are receiving other supplementary payments. But also, this is the most substantial rise in the JobSeeker payment since 1986 and we’re now going to see the JobSeeker payment at around 41 per cent of the national minimum wage back to where it was in the 2000s. This is a substantial cost to the Budget, it is a structural spend, it is around $9 billion over the forward estimates, but we think it is necessary and we think it will help people with their cost of living expenses. But it was never meant to be a replacement wage, it was always a part of the safety net which helps those out of work, get back into work, and that is what our focus has been. And if you look at our record Pete, pre-pandemic, we saw welfare dependency go to its lowest level in thirty years. That was good for the Budget but most importantly, it was good for the families at home because it saw people move from the unemployment queue into work and that is our absolute number one focus.
PETER STEFANOVIC:
Treasurer Josh Frydenberg appreciate your time as always, talk to you soon.
JOSH FRYDENBERG:
Good to be with you.