PAUL CULLIVER:
Julie Collins is the federal Minister for Housing and Minister for Homelessness and joins you on the line. Good afternoon to you, Minister.
JULIE COLLINS:
Good afternoon, Paul, and to your listeners this afternoon.
CULLIVER:
What’s getting done in Lake Mac?
COLLINS:
Well, it was great to be with the local member Sharon Claydon this morning to be able to announce and open 10 new social housing homes, and to announce another 9 that will be built and another 9 that have already been refurbished. This is from the Social Housing Accelerator Fund, money that we have provided to the NSW Government. And what today was about was about a partnership between 3 tiers of government – local government, state government and federal government – to get more homes on the ground more quickly. And that’s what we need to see more of right around the country. And obviously, our Social Housing Accelerator was $2 billion that we provided to states and territories around 12 months ago now, and is part of our $32 billion Homes for Australia plan.
CULLIVER:
So, what will these social housing dwellings be used for? Who will be able to access these houses?
COLLINS:
Well, they’ll be people off the social housing waiting list and as I’ve said, there’s already been 9 refurbishments and they will be getting people in them. The homes that we stood in front of today, I understand there’ll be a handover today from the builders and people will be in those homes within weeks. And in terms of the new announcement for the ones at Wallsend, they’ll be under construction very soon and should be complete by the middle of next year, and have new tenants in them by the second half of next year. So, moving very quickly and this is obviously just the start of what we’re doing with our housing investments. We also will have the first round of our Housing Australia Future Fund and the National Housing Accord being announced later this year, around the end of August. But of course, those funds, particularly the Housing Australia Future Fund, was held up in the Senate by more than 6 months by the Liberal and the Greens senators. So, it is later than we had hoped, but we are going as quickly as we can to get as many homes on the ground as fast as we can.
CULLIVER:
Well, indeed. So, we’re talking about, you know, roughly 20 new homes here in totality. And obviously they are a benefit to the people that they will now house. But people might hear that and go, ‘9, 10 extra houses – it’s not making that much of a dent’.
COLLINS:
Well, we’re announcing homes like this all over the country though, and they will start to make a dent. And, of course, they are part of our ambitious shared national housing target to reach 1.2 million homes across the country. And these are homes of every type, not just social homes. We’re talking about homes to buy, homes for people to rent and, of course, social and affordable housing, as well as of course we know we need more transitional housing for women and children fleeing family violence, as well particularly. And we are building all of the above as fast as we can, working with other tiers of government. We had a historic agreement through National Cabinet in August last year, whereby the states committed to planning, zoning, land release reforms that will be very significant. And indeed, the Grattan Institute has said that our supply plan to add more homes could save renters around $32 billion. So, they are significant reforms. We’ve already seen the NSW Government move to do some of that planning and zoning reform, and they’re making great progress. But it’s only by having all tiers of government working together, working with community housing providers, working with the construction sector, that we’re actually going to be able to meet our shared national ambitious target of 1.2 million homes. We’re ambitious because we need to be, Paul, because we know we don’t have enough homes in Australia. We haven’t had enough homes for a long time. After a decade of neglect under the former government, we’ve got a lot of work to do and that’s what we’re getting on and doing, which is what you saw today.
CULLIVER:
Well, speaking of that ambitious plan, Oxford Economics yesterday released a report, Building in Australia. Their forecast says that you’re going to achieve 960,000 new homes will be built between now and 2029, compared to that target of 1.2 million, so falling short by over 200,000. Do you think they’ve got that modelling right?
COLLINS:
Well, of course what we want to do is we want to change things, which is what our $32 billion Homes for Australia plan is about. And if we see the states and the territories do the planning reforms that they’ve agreed to, if you see investments coming from other tiers of government, if you see 3 tiers of government working together, if we get more institutional investment, if we’re all working together with our shoulder to the wheel, we will get much closer to that. It is ambitious because it needs to be, Paul. We need a bit of ambition. We don’t have enough homes, and we haven’t for a long time. When you look at the number of homes that Australia has, particularly compared to the OECD average, we don’t have enough homes and we haven’t had enough homes for a long time. So, we need to get a good pipeline of homes and that’s what our work is all about.
CULLIVER:
Ok. But given that report yesterday by Oxford Economics, they’re basically saying, as it stands, what the Labor government is doing and in concert with state governments and councils as well, we’re going to fall short. So, do you need to do more? Do you need to do something different?
COLLINS:
Well, what you saw was us adding to our agenda in the last Budget with a further $6 billion, working as part of our $32 billion Homes for Australia plan. Since we’ve come to office now, we’ve announced $32 billion in new housing initiatives. We’ve had the significant National Cabinet agreement do a range of planning and zoning reforms, as I’ve said. We expect that this will make a big difference across the country. We are investing at every opportunity since we’ve come to government. We have announced new investments, and as I said, it’s not just our target. It’s a shared national target, working with other tiers of government, working with the sector to turn this around and to get more homes on the ground more quickly.
CULLIVER:
Your guest today is the federal Minister for Housing, Julie Collins. Of course, in the region today launching some of those new social housing dwellings that are being opened in our region, in Lake Macquarie. You are listening to ABC Newcastle. Paul Culliver with you. Of course, after the last week, we’ve been seeing a series of reporting and investigation over the CFMEU, the Construction, Forestry and Maritime Employees Union. Emerging allegations about criminal ties and the associated impact on what might be happening with government money there. The affiliation of the construction industry superfund Cbus, they have contribution to Labor’s affordable housing scheme. Some senators on the other side of the aisle saying that board members from the CFMEU contributing to Cbus should walk away. Indeed, Cbus should not be involved in that housing affordability fund. What is the status there in terms of CFMEU’s influence on those projects?
COLLINS:
Well, of course, we’ve said there’s zero tolerance for what the allegations and what we’ve seen in terms of the media reporting around what’s happening with the CFMEU. Zero tolerance. We have taken the strongest possible action. We’ve said we’re appointing an administrator through Fair Work. We are moving as quickly as we can and taking the strongest possible action we can. When it comes to Housing Australia and when it comes to housing across the country, what we’re focused on is getting housing on the ground as quickly as we can. We also, of course, want to make sure that we get value for taxpayer dollar and we want to make sure that we deal with some of the supply constraints around a shortage of labour, a shortage of materials. We’re investing more in Fee‑Free TAFE. We’re investing in a Future Made in Australia. We’re looking at modular and non‑traditional methods of construction to get homes up as quickly as we can. And we’re working, as I’ve said, right across government, but importantly with other tiers of government and with the sector to get these homes up as fast as we can.
CULLIVER:
Ok. Is it appropriate to have CFMEU representatives on the board of Cbus that are committing money to Labor’s Housing Australia Future Fund?
COLLINS:
Look, Cbus is an independent organisation and its board is a matter for that organisation. What I’m focused on is making sure that we do due diligence, that we get value for this Australian taxpayer as part of Housing Australia and our investments. That’s what we focused on – getting homes on the ground, getting the best value for dollar for the Australian taxpayer, and making sure that we get the homes up as quickly as we can, the right homes in the right places, including in regional cities like Newcastle.
CULLIVER:
All right. Should the Housing Australia Future Fund have money contributed to by a fund which has board members from the CFMEU?
COLLINS:
Well, the Housing Australia Future Fund at the moment has funds from the Australian taxpayer and that’s what we’re focused on, getting the returns for the Australian taxpayer to make sure that our investments are the best possible investments for the Australian taxpayer. We’re working incredibly hard, as I’ve said repeatedly, with other tiers of government, with the sector and the industry to get these homes up out of the ground as fast as we can.
CULLIVER:
Ok, but is the Future Fund going to accept funding from Cbus?
COLLINS:
Well, it doesn’t do that. Its contracts are with community housing providers. That’s how it works. The community housing providers and the state and territory governments, they are the people that have the contracts that get the homes built and that’s what we’re focused on.
CULLIVER:
Okay, does Cbus have any influence on what’s happening when it comes to the houses being built by the Fund?
COLLINS:
Absolutely not.
CULLIVER:
Okay, just finally, I want to talk about the emergence of deepfakes in domestic politics in Queensland. People might have seen this online. It’s doing the rounds on social media. Steven Miles, of course, the current Premier of Queensland. There’s been a deep fake turning up of him dancing. The LNP appears to have put this out just in the last hour. The ABC has reported that the ALP has previously actually published a clip of Peter Dutton the Opposition Leader created using generative artificial intelligence to its TikTok account. Do you think it’s appropriate to use generative AI to portray political actors doing things that they clearly did not?
COLLINS:
Some of the deepfake material is a really serious matter. I mean, I heard from one of my colleagues today who was at an inquiry into deepfake sexual material, which is a really serious issue. And obviously we are concerned about that. And we’re concerned about digitally created and altered particularly sexually explicit material that’s shared without consent that can be really damaging. And we’re looking at legislative legislation to make sure that people who share digitally created sexually explicit material without consent will be subject to serious criminal penalties. But we are concerned about the serious nature of some of the deepfakes, particularly on social media.
CULLIVER:
Was it appropriate for the Australian Labor Party TikTok to post, to post an AI generated video of Peter Dutton dancing?
COLLINS:
Well, I think that there’s a very big difference between something that is considered to be amusing or funny, as opposed to something that is really serious material. It is up to independent organisations such as the Queensland Electoral Commission or the Australian Electoral Commission in terms of electoral advertising about what is appropriate. But I think that there is a big difference between some of that material that you’re talking about.
CULLIVER:
Would you feel entirely comfortable if the opposition started posting deepfakes of you doing things that you hadn’t done?
COLLINS:
Look, as I said, I think that there’s a big difference between some of the really serious material that people have raised concerns about, and there is a difference between some of the electoral material. Some of it, of course, should not be put up. Some of it is a bit different, is intended to be humorous, and I think that there is a difference between the 2.
CULLIVER:
Would it be better to just ban all of it?
COLLINS:
Well, that is obviously something that could be considered. Certainly, I think the Queensland Electoral Commission will have a look in terms of the case in Queensland. You know, this sort of material, I think, is concerning. I think most Australians are concerned that this type of material is being produced. But as I said, I think there is a big difference between some of the material and some of this really serious material out there.
CULLIVER:
Minister, thanks for your time today.
COLLINS:
Thank you.