Jayne Azzopardi:
The Federal Government is facing calls this morning to extend its JobKeeper program to more people after an accounting bungle delivered a $60 billion windfall. We’re joined now by the Assistant Treasurer, Michael Sukkar. Good morning to you, Minister.
Minister Sukkar:
Good morning, Jayne.
Jayne Azzopardi:
You now have $60 billion you weren’t expecting, we know that this is borrowed money but if you’ve already done the sums, why can’t you extend it to people who were initially left out, I’m talking aviation, university workers and people in the arts?
Minister Sukkar:
Well importantly, Jayne, and this scheme is a demand-driven scheme so it will be there to support 3.5 million employees and some 800,000 businesses. That hasn’t changed and so it is there and fully available. But as you rightly point out, this is borrowed money and the original $130 billion figure that was estimated by Treasury, it was just an estimate. It wasn’t an objective, it wasn’t a target so, in the end, this is just $60 billion less that Australia has to borrow and, in the end, is $60 billion less that our children and grandchildren will have to repay.
Jayne Azzopardi:
Well in an interview last week, you said that JobKeeper was doing its job because more than six million Australians were going to benefit. You also said in that interview that if it was only three million, there’d be more likelihood of wholesale changes to the scheme. Well, now there is only 3.5 million Australians, so do you stand by that?
Minister Sukkar:
Well, Jayne, of course there’s a review that will be conducted by Treasury. This is a review that we always planned to undertake at the half-time mark and no doubt, with the changed reporting of numbers, of course that will feed into that review. But again, this is a large scheme by any measure, covering 3.5 million employees, covering 800,000 businesses so I don’t think that anyone can accuse it of being a small scheme. And again, it needs to be put into some context of the entire suite of reforms that the Government has put in place – whether it’s a cash flow boost for small business, whether it’s the JobSeeker payment of $1,100 a fortnight for people who can’t get JobKeeper, early access to superannuation and of course, stimulus payments to households. So, there’s an entire suite of support that we’ve put in place. JobKeeper – an important part though it is – is just one part. It is doing an important job but, in the end, again, the health outcomes have been better than we thought and I think that means that the economic outcomes have been slightly better than what was originally expected.
Jayne Azzopardi:
But does that review mean that you would consider extending this program?
Minister Sukkar:
I’m not suggesting that, Jayne, what I’m saying is that, of course the review will take into account the updated figures. We were getting reported the figures that we had all understood them to be – about 6.5 million employees. It’s turned out to be 3.5 million because of reporting issues that were put in place by, particularly the applicants who had overestimated the number of employees that they had. That has now been reconciled. Of course, the updated figured will form part of that review but I’m not suggesting, Jayne, that that’s necessarily going to be a catalyst for changing the program. The program is doing an important job, as has been intended.
Jayne Azzopardi:
But under this program then, why is a job in hospitality more important than, say, a job in the arts or at a university?
Minister Sukkar:
Well there’s no ranking of jobs at all. What we have said…interrupted.
Jayne Azzopardi:
But some people are getting it and some people are not which would suggest that there is?
Minister Sukkar:
No, no, the parameters are there for all industries, all businesses and all sectors. If you’re a very large business, you have to have had a turnover reduction of 50 per cent. If you’re a small or medium business, you have to have seen a reduction in turnover of 30 per cent. Those parameters are there, they are economy-wide, and they apply to every business equally. If you fall into it, then yes, your employees are entitled to JobKeeper. If you haven’t seen the requisite reductions in turnover and your employees don’t fall in but they are unable to work, they lose their job, then they are, of course, entitled to JobSeeker payments. So again, JobKeeper is one very important part of support, but it’s not the entire picture.
Jayne Azzopardi:
There are a lot of people who do feel left by this. The Opposition Leader, Anthony Albanese, says that this is a mistake that you could’ve seen from space. If you got this wrong, can people have confidence that there aren’t more errors on the way?
Minister Sukkar:
Well I think Australians to have great confidence in the suite of measures that we’ve put in place including this scheme. Again, the $130 billion was an estimate, it wasn’t an objective, it wasn’t a target and as the health outcomes have been better than we thought, the economic outcomes are better than we thought. When Treasury came up with the estimate of $130 billion, it looked like that the peak of coronavirus would be much worse, it looked like restrictions in the economy would go much deeper and much longer. So as that’s improved at a rate better than we thought, of course the cost of JobKeeper to Australian taxpayers has reduced and I think that we would all celebrate that because the benefit to the economy has basically flowed from the outstanding work that’s been done in a health sphere.
Jayne Azzopardi:
I think that you are going to face a lot of pressure to find somewhere to spend that $60 billion regardless of that but Assistant Treasurer, thank you for your time this morning.
Minister Sukkar:
Thanks so much, Jayne.