Tom Connell:
My next guest joining me live now is the Assistant Treasurer, Michael Sukkar. Thanks very much for your time. I just wanted to get your reaction to this. We've just had response from the Chinese Embassy to this inquiry. “The draft resolution” – this what the Embassy has tweeted on COVID-19 – “to be adopted by the WHA is totally different from Australia's proposal of an independent, international review. A close look at the draft itself can easily come to a conclusion. To claim the WHA's resolution is a vindication of Australia's call is nothing but a joke”. This is from the Embassy. What's your response to that?
Minister Sukkar:
Well good to be with you, Tom. Look I'm not going to get into rebutting anything that's been placed on Twitter. I think it's pretty clear to all who have watched this over the last few days. Australia has led the world on this and there's been significant support for a review into the origins and in the end, we're doing what we think is in the best interests of Australians, which is to make sure that the health and well-being of Australians – particularly in a globally interconnected world – is protected into the future and we think it's eminently sensible that a review of this type takes place. Obviously, there's been a huge support for it globally because it's fairly uncontroversial, I would have thought, and Australia is obviously very grateful that so many nations around the world supported that view and that that review will be undertaken. But, Tom, I'm not going to get into rebutting one way or another, statements that are made.
Connell:
There must be some concern though for China's co-operation, when the Embassy is calling that the prospect of this being an independent international review, that a reading that this would be independent and international is nothing but a joke. There must be concern about the extent to which Beijing will cooperate?
Sukkar:
Well in the end, Tom, these will be matters for the WHO, who has been tasked with undertaking this work and I think there will be, again, many nations around the world very keenly interested in the outcomes of the review and I think that interest should give us some confidence, Tom, that there will be scrutiny on the process and scrutiny over the investigation that takes place because in the end, this isn't about ascribing blame. It's about finding out what happened, how it happened and, most importantly, how we can mitigate these risks into the future. Again, in a globally interconnected world that we live in now, things that happen on the other side of the world, our nation's not immune from. So, that's why we have led the world on this – absolutely led the world – stood up for our values and we're very grateful that so many nations have supported that leadership.
Connell:
I want to turn to your areas. Lots of predictions about what COVID-19 will do to the housing sector including prices. Talk of a 30 per cent slump as a worst-case scenario. What's your view on where this is headed?
Sukkar:
Well Tom, there's not a great deal of data yet. I mean, we’re seven or eight weeks into the pandemic in earnest, so there's not a great deal of data. There's obviously a whole lot of organisations and individuals that have projected where they think the market is going to go. In the end, the housing market is a function of a couple of things. It's a function of the broader strength of the economy, obviously, and it's also a function of supply and demand. So many of the issues we've had in recent years around affordability of housing has been the inability of the housing market to maintain supply that meets increasing demand. So, they’re the basic factors, I think, Tom, it's a bit early to say with any great certainty where the market will go but I think what, in a sense goes without saying but is worth reminding everybody, imagine if Labor won the last election and their housing taxes were in place now, how devastating that would be? Those housing taxes are still Labor policy. In the end, we're focused on the strength of the economy. If you get that right, if your economy is strong, then the rest looks after itself, including what is the single biggest asset for most Australians and that's their home.
Connell:
There's every chance though, that there's going to be a bit more of a decoupling of that link given we're going to see a huge cut to immigration. The borders are up right now. We know how much of a driver that is for the population. Do you need to look at – and I’m not talk about prices here, but how big the housing construction industry in Australia is – is the possibility of stimulus in some way needed from the Government because otherwise we could see a lot of jobs go?
Sukkar:
Well again, Tom, we’ll be informed by the data. What we put in place thus far with the JobKeeper program, which has now reached nearly 890,000 businesses, 6.3 million employees and one of the largest beneficiaries of that has been the construction sector, because it is a large component of the economy or the wage subsidy for apprentices. That support is in place and that support is ensuring that those firms and those projects are able to continue. In the end though, like all these things, we’ll be watching it very closely. I'm in constant contact with all of the relevant stakeholders, literally on a daily basis and it's quite interesting. If I look at the First Home Loan Deposit Scheme – which we set up at the beginning of this year which enables first home buyers to purchase a property with a deposit of as little as five per cent with a government guarantee – we saw a significant decline in the number of people who took those First Home Loan Deposit Scheme guarantees in March. It picked up a little bit in April and has picked up even more strongly since then. I'm not suggesting that that's a proxy for the market more broadly but it’s just very interesting that the data we have seen saw that impact really strongly at the beginning of the pandemic but it has started to pick up and we now have only 800 of the 10,000 guarantees remaining. It's been an extraordinarily popular program and just looking at the way that it's tracked, I think is interesting for the broader market too.
Connell:
Well interesting, yeah maybe some bargain hunters out there and a good sign as you say potentially, albeit not getting ahead of yourself. With construction though – I know you mentioned JobKeeper – construction never shut down, so it's so far been largely unaffected. What you're saying in terms of keeping an eye on this, are you open to some form of stimulus? Labor’s talking about, maybe social or affordable housing. If there's going to be a big gap looming here, the government's ready and willing to step in?
Sukkar:
Well Tom, the point I'm making is we've already put in huge support – whether it’s JobKeeper, whether it's a wage subsidy for apprentices which we all know disproportionally positively impacts the construction industry – those things are cornerstones that have supported the industry thus far. I think the JobKeeper package itself has also improved confidence throughout the economy and I think there's a number of measures that actually support that. But like all these things and whether it's in tourism, whether it's in construction, of course Tom, we're keeping an eye on it, we're seeing how it’s tracking. The construction industry – whether it's residential or other construction – is a massive employer in this country, a massive generator of wealth and prosperity – and we're keeping a very close eye on it. But we're, to some degree, in the eye of the storm at the moment. We're seven or eight weeks into the pandemic, we've put in place, as I said, unprecedented support, of which the construction industry is a massive beneficiary, and we’ll be informed by their feedback, from the industry and what the data looks like. But there’s no “set-and-forget”, Tom, as I've said to you on a number of occasions, and we're obviously keeping an eye on every aspect of the economy including the construction industry.
Connell:
All right, Housing Minister and Assistant Treasurer, Michael Sukkar, thanks for your time today.
Sukkar:
Thanks Tom.