ASHLEIGH GILLON:
Welcome back to AM Agenda. Joining me this morning on our panel of politicians, the Assistant Treasurer Nick Sherry good morning.
NICK SHERRY:
Morning, Ashleigh, Steve, and to your viewers.
ASHLEIGH GILLON:
And also the Shadow Small Business Minister, Steve Ciobo, hello.
STEVEN CIOBO:
Good morning, Ashleigh.
ASHLEIGH GILLON:
So, the ETS vote is finally going to happen in the Senate today. Nick Sherry, are you resigned that this legislation is going to fail?
NICK SHERRY:
Well, Labor will be voting in the national interest. We'll be voting for a scheme that has been debated now for ten years. We intend to vote to reduce carbon pollution in this country.
Unfortunately, it seems very likely that all of the Opposition, Liberal-National Party, the Greens, the independents, are going to vote against it, and that's not in the national interest.
ASHLEIGH GILLON:
Why do you think this legislation is so unpopular? As you point out, it's not just the Coalition against this.
NICK SHERRY:
Well interestingly, the Coalition, the Liberal-National Party, will actually be voting against legislation, a policy that they themselves put to the last election having developed when they were last in government.
But this issue's been well debated. We believe we strike the right balance and we believe it's important for the country's future, the national interest, and particularly our kids and grandkids, to deal with this issue now.
ASHLEIGH GILLON:
But that doesn't answer my question. Why is this so unpopular? It's the Greens, the independents and the Coalition - all are saying the scheme's a dud.
NICK SHERRY:
Well, you've got on the one hand the Liberal-National Party that are bitterly divided between themselves. I mean Malcolm Turnbull doesn't know what to do, he can't deliver, and that's one reason why they're going to vote it down.
And secondly of course, the Greens want a scheme that is much, much tougher. So Labor's proposals strike the right balance.
[Unrelated items: question to Steven Ciobo and Ciobo's response]
ASHLEIGH GILLON:
Nick Sherry, I have to say, I haven't heard an argument that's convinced me that these two pieces of legislation need to be linked; the renewable energy scheme seems like it could go through the Senate without having to tie it to the ETS.
NICK SHERRY:
Well they're fundamentally about the same thing...
STEVE CIOBO:
[Laughs]
NICK SHERRY:
...about improving our environment.
STEVE CIOBO:
Well, why not split them?
NICK SHERRY:
They are clearly linked. I mean, they are clearly linked. We're dealing with carbon pollution reduction and alternative energy. I mean, so...
ASHLEIGH GILLON:
But you could get going on the renewable stuff straightaway while you start to figure out...
STEVE CIOBO:
But we said...
NICK SHERRY: In term...
STEVE CIOBO:
...we'll support it. Why won't you break them?
NICK SHERRY:
In terms of carbon pollution, this issue has been debated for ten years.
We've been in government for 18 months. We made a clear commitment at the last election, as indeed the Liberal-National Party did. And they're going to vote against a scheme that they put up at the last election; they're going to vote against their own scheme effectively, very similar to ours.
But in terms of an election, that is the furthest thing from this Government's mind.
STEVE CIOBO:
[Laughs]
NICK SHERRY: I mean, I spend all of my waking hours and a lot of my sleeping hours, along with my colleagues, worrying about the global financial economic crisis and our response to that. That's our - that's one of our key priorities.
[Unrelated items: question to Steven Ciobo and Ciobo's response]
NICK SHERRY:
The fact is the Liberal Party, presumably this morning, will vote against a policy that it took to the last elections. Not just voting against Labor's policy...
STEVEN CIOBO:
[Interrupts] Because it's so flawed.
NICK SHERRY:
... that it took to the last election, and secondly...
STEVEN CIOBO:
[Interrupts] The [indistinct] policy is flawed.
NICK SHERRY:
... the Liberal Party doesn't have a policy at the moment. They've got a thought bubble that they issued earlier in the week, the party room did not endorse it as policy, they haven't prepared amendments because they are so divided.
You listen to the debate in the senate and you hear Liberal senator, we know the National Party are going to vote against anything, so they're divided, the Opposition are divided on that. You listen to the Liberal senators. They don't believe there's a problem, many of them, and many of them and this is the challenge for Malcolm Turnbull, they're a house divided. How do you negotiate with a house divided, it hasn't even prepared amendments, it doesn't have a currently policy and is going to vote against the policy it took to the last election.
[Unrelated items: question to Steve Ciobo and Ciobo's response]
NICK SHERRY:
Ashleigh look, it's not arrogant of a Government to put a policy proposal to reduce carbon at the last election 18 months ago, to be now putting that forward.
This issue has been debated for the best part of 10 years, it's in the national interest, and the scheme that we are voting on later today that's in the national interest, is very similar to that which the Liberal Party took to the last election which they've now recanted on because they're so divided.
You can't negotiate or it's very difficult to negotiate with a House that's divided. We know the nationals are not going to vote for anything and as I say, you listen to the Liberals and the speeches they're making in the Senate, many of them are not going to vote for anything. That's the problem Malcolm Turnbull has. He can't adopt a policy, he can't deliver the policy that he helped develop at the last elections. They are so bitterly divided over this.
[Unrelated items: question to Steven Ciobo and Ciobo's response]
NICK SHERRY:
[Interrupts] The Liberal Party doesn't have a policy, I mean that's their problem. They can't - they cannot agree on a policy. They've got some modelling, the Government's done plenty of modelling and indeed the previous Government did plenty of modelling through Treasury. We know that. This thing's been modelled to death for the last 10 years; it's been debated to death...
STEVEN CIOBO:
[Interrupts] Well why won't you release it?
NICK SHERRY:
... and the trouble is the Liberal Party, the thought bubble, the modelling that was released earlier in the week, the Liberal party room didn't endorse it.
STEVEN CIOBO:
Why won't you release the modelling?
NICK SHERRY:
You don't have a policy.
ASHLEIGH GILLON:
Okay well it's taken us more than 18 months to this point, where we're finally getting a senate vote today. We're going to have at least another three months to debate this when this legislation...
STEVEN CIOBO:
And it's going to be voted down.
NICK SHERRY:
Yeah.
ASHLEIGH GILLON:
...comes back. So we'll wrap it up for there for now. We'll look forward to that vote finally happening in the Senate this morning. Nick Sherry, Steve Ciobo, thanks for your time.
NICK SHERRY:
Okay. Good morning.