KIERAN GILBERT:
Australia is joining a crucial dialogue in Singapore to progress a regional crackdown on costly scamming activity. Assistant Treasurer Stephen Jones is leading Australia’s delegation, which unites the banking sector with cyber experts and other key stakeholders. I spoke to Mr Jones about the trip a short time ago. Assistant Treasurer Stephen Jones. Thanks for your time. I know you’re about to depart Sydney Airport for a delegation to Singapore. I want to talk to you about that in a moment. But a few other stories around today, the departure of Peter Costello from the Nine board as chair, is that a welcome development? Is it the right call?
STEPHEN JONES:
Look, it’s entirely a matter for Channel Nine and their board, but I just would say more broadly that I think it’s the expectation of everyone in public life that when we’re dealing with members of the media, including yourself, Kieran that we deal with each other in a respectful way. I think that’s just a bare minimum that we should all expect in public life.
GILBERT:
The Coalition on another front has declared its support and commitment to the Paris agreement. Do you welcome that despite the reports over the weekend?
JONES:
A pretty messy period over the weekend. I think what it underscores is the fact that the Coalition are all over the place on energy. They’ve had over 20 energy policies over the last decade, another 2 over the weekend, by the look of it. And what it sends a very clear message is there’s going to be no certainty around energy policy under the Coalition. We’ve had 10 years of this. It’s why we’re behind in infrastructure development, it’s why we’re behind in energy generation. We just need clear policy. Clear policy certainty. The only way we’re going to get energy prices down over the long term is ensuring that we’ve got certain steady, reliable, predictable energy policy so that we can have certain steady, reliable, predictable energy generation and distribution. Critical for industry, critical for households.
GILBERT:
They’re saying they’re being transparent because the government is not going to meet its 43 per cent target by 2030. So, they’re simply being upfront and honest.
JONES:
What they’re being is the same old Coalition which is at war with itself over energy. You’ve got the National Party trying to drag them back to the 1850s. You’ve got them unable to secure an energy consensus inside their party room, which means they will be unable to secure an energy policy for the country should they ever form government. What we need, what industry needs, what households needs, is certainty on energy policy, not a party that can have 3 separate positions over a long weekend in June. And that’s exactly what we’ve seen from the Coalition.
GILBERT:
You’re leading this delegation to Singapore. It’s over the issue of scammers. These are a phenomenon that we’re seeing right around the world, countries grappling with this. What can your delegation learn from Singapore? What can they learn from us?
JONES:
Last year, I attended an international fraud summit hosted by the British government. Reached out to our Singaporean counterparts. They’re doing some great stuff. We’re also doing some really innovative stuff here in Australia. We agreed to catch up, and this delegation that I’m taking up, which includes myself, my colleague, my counterpart from New Zealand, Andrew Bayly, it includes the banking representatives of both countries, plus representatives from our National Anti‑Scam Centre, meeting with our counterparts in Singapore. Particularly interested in 2 things. The technology that they’re utilising to take the fight up to the scammers, but also any of the enforcement or protective mechanisms they’re putting in place. For example, they’re a bit more advanced than we are in the area of blocking calls and SMS messages. We’ve got policies that we are rolling out over the end of this year to ensure we upgrade our technologies in this area, but very keen to see what the Singaporeans are doing. Also got some great technologies around bank applications which enable consumers to put a fast stop on their bank accounts to have identification payee details. In fact, in a couple of areas they’re doing some great stuff. But of course, our National Anti‑Scam Centre, the projects that we’ve put in place, in addition to that, have seen scams come down over the last year. Collaboration absolutely critical because so often the perpetrators of these crimes are operating internationally, and therefore we need international cooperation.
GILBERT:
And not just government to government, as you pointed out, you’re taking the banks as well. So, whatever the breakthroughs, whatever great innovations Singapore is delivering, they can learn firsthand there.
JONES:
Exactly right. To beat this fight against the scammers, we’ve got to have an ecosystem approach which looks at pillars in the ecosystem, banks, telecommunications companies and social media platforms, because they’re the way the scams get to us, and that’s the bucket of money at the end of the scam transaction. So, having each of those parties working together, led by government, with strong protections and obligations driven by government, is absolutely critical. But it’s got to be a partnership. Can’t do this without the banks, the social media companies and the telecommunications companies all in there fighting this together.
GILBERT:
Assistant Treasurer Stephen Jones, thanks. But before you go, I just should ask you about that news poll numbers have narrowed. Are you worried about that?
JONES:
Look, every election in this country is a real contest. And the next election in 12 months time will be a contest as well. But my number one priority between now and then is taking the fight up to the scammers to ensure that Australia is the hardest place in the world for these criminals to do their business and to ensure that we can keep Australia’s money safe.
GILBERT:
Appreciate your time. Talk to you soon.
JONES:
Good to be with you, mate.